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War Machine vs Spider-Man

ProjectCornDog

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War Machine vs Spider-Man
« on: April 06, 2019, 09:42:34 AM »
I think we can all agree that Spider-Man (as we have seen in several issues) can't beat Iron Man. He can deliver some damage, he has even escaped an angry Iron Man, hell he somehow even defeated Iron Man 2020! But the standard Tony Stark in modern armor? Nah.

However, how about War Machine? Who gets the majority.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2019, 09:52:06 AM by ProjectCornDog »

AP

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2019, 10:37:59 AM »
Spidey should still lose IMO.

Red Exodus

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2019, 11:20:03 AM »
Peter should lose even more against Rhodes, given how he's packing a lot more destructive firepower.

ProjectCornDog

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2019, 11:51:52 AM »
Peter should lose even more against Rhodes, given how he's packing a lot more destructive firepower.

Less shields, presumably slower, probably can't anticipate his movements like Iron Man did during Civil War. I think Spidey can get close, he can do some damage.




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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2019, 02:12:32 PM »
Feels a little out of Spide's league. If War Machine just wants to fire off any weapon from height and distance Spidey can't get him. He'd have to trick him in close

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2019, 03:28:55 AM »
Less shields

But a lot more firepower. Shoulder cannons, missles, wrist guns, and other artillery, on top of the usual
repulsor weaponry.

Its basically Green Goblin but cranked to 11, and Peter has had lots of trouble facing any of the Goblins
along his career.

Quote
presumably slower

Never has it been mentioned that the suit is slower than Tony's, nor has it ever been shown to
be in comparison.

Quote
probably can't anticipate his movements like Iron Man did during Civil War.

Rhodey's a soldier, and a well trained one at that. In one instance, he beat the living shit out
of a group of villains who had apparently studied all of Tony's moves.

Quote
I think Spidey can get close, he can do some damage.

Not likely, given how Rhodey's fought evenly against Namor, fought against X-Force alone and
held his own, and at least held off Exodus for some time before eventually getting beaten, just
to name a few instances.

His armor will tank anything throws at him and laugh it off.

Quote
Images SNIP

Here's the problem.

1. You clearly didn't do your homework, as you'd know that the Iron Man Peter is beating here
is NOT Tony Stark. That is Arno Stark from the year 2020.

2. Earlier in that fight, he's after a kid who grows up to be a terrorist. Peter is obviously protecting
the kid (he doesn't know Arno's reasons for coming to the past, let alone know that its not Tony
in that armor but a different Iron Man), and Arno says that his weapons' are so destructive that
he can't tag either Spider-Man or the kid without killing them. So he's purposely holding back
(sorf of, he does threaten Spider-Man a few times).

3. It seemed that Arno's armor was malfunctioning during the fight.

Either way, that wasn't the real Tony Stark, so your example doesn't work.

The *Actual* fights Tony's had with Peter go like this :

Tony completely owns Peter here.
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/60199/2010498-1076102_scan0019_super.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11114/111142536/4140575-scan0020-1.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/60199/2010500-1076105_scan0021_super.jpg

This is when Peter had his spider abilities from the totem. Impressive enough in tanking an
allegedly full power repulsor chest beam (I call bullshit because there's no way Peter should
have tanked it) but Peter has to give everything he has to literally overweb Tony. Although he
does have him immobilized, Tony has the chance to take Peter out during his interrogation
as well as after, but lets him go on account of Aunt May, so this one's a draw.
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/peter-parker-vs-iron-man-one-more-day-1.jpg
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/peter-parker-vs-iron-man-one-more-day-2.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/6jZ5Pe5qwJcz0F5DTiuxxMFoaklglii6zNBZegEw1__MNZIphIAnL836EGo5FGtHsks1Aavj4BA8=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/Brg17DN5GoIubJCrGlVobOQ5UemWnCrT4yMOdotPZYiAVXWX34SkH10EHSL7z_Gvd4KdGsI5O6r9=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/UsYaDKfPasKKJiVq6bg6Y0955H4VjsATnf47iKZIImsCQFEYrRa_bimfVycErGaWLufEi-JnKnmf=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/s3LzvpiguKaPFKsxudefzUThNDWjO_6V5iPmcbyfR8KcrRdZ9B0OqLAOhHRr9RNIqaliXcpa0Cii=s1600

Only lost here because Peter had previously hacked his armor. Prior to it kicking in, Peter is looking
worse for the wear against him, while Tony is pretty much fine.
https://2static1.fjcdn.com/comments/Blank+_da53fa9f36bc32dac005ebbca48a9f36.jpg
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-1250229d6af0a249a342896580736f2f
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11124/111240936/4991414-2381485842-20109.jpg

Mostly Tony beating Peter who gets in one shot and then has his armor turned off. Webs up Tony
and then runs. So right here, Peter is forced to retreat, which counts as a win for Tony. This is with
Peter in the Iron Spider Suit btw, not standard Spider-Man.
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/CvhGdtERkjH35G8lfPk_pZz9EAsIrHbthhUQxom95rvdyjeGLZw0zr3rKSVyp_h6KSmIYX3ENeVg=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/TcK2aH8z7FzvXN_DNbl-B9qUOV82x8XjpKdp8j6jTwWGylwY2zv-SkVUOindNVo_iBasd7bBc7LQ=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/wl-_bpegHfZvuftU9NqkELpBP1acKW3NW1rOZCrdVox4v7wQTyv6fAkKaQVjF56AnvgqfFbgd5gz=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/EMhKW86t7qMUnGRJi5IXjwZzh_nA2VYAXVm8xnudTmuA55PV6jSsGqOw3eIkUi3NPhfj15YCxD2K=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/zjSN2D9VkSG-10G-p4LWidaxdXfviW5CkCI5Py0Hf0Rnqw8BxBcJFGmk6KC2rU_hyzY77zCQ29Pv=s1600

Another Iron Spider fight. Well, not much of one. He gets one hit on Tony, then dodges some blasts
before running into reinforced glass. All Peter can do here is fight defensively.
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/iron-spidey-vs-iron-man-civil-war-1.jpg
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/iron-spidey-vs-iron-man-civil-war-2.jpg
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/iron-spidey-vs-iron-man-civil-war-3.jpg
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/iron-spidey-vs-iron-man-civil-war-4.jpg

So in total
1. Normal Spider-Man has 1 win (via prep) and one loss
2. Iron Spider has no conclusive fights, but looks to be more on the wear than Tony in the fights.
3. Totem Spider-Man has one draw.

Keep in mind that Tony seems to hold back a lot against Peter. Rhodey isn't close to Parker in
the same way and wouldn't be as inclined to.

ProjectCornDog

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2019, 11:04:10 AM »
HEY!

I was about to say "you made a great argument" until you misinterpreted my point about Iron Man 2020. I own the original issue, I know it's Arno Stark from the future. My point is, TECHNICALLY, a future Iron Man armor should be more advanced than old War Machine armor (which hasn't been truly ugpraded in a while because as Tony has said to Rhodey as recently as Secret Wars 2, 'do you have half a billion dollars lying around?')

But good arguments otherwise. The X-Force feat seems pretty l33t.

Sick Nick

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2019, 10:40:24 AM »
In one of those scans, Peter says he might be stronger than Iron Man 'if I put my mind to it'

That's fucking crazy. Back in the day, Tony threw down with Namor several times and held his own, and going into the 90s, looked to be easily in Thing's weight class for strength, even without an external amp.

Just goes to show how far Tony's fallen. The spotlight's on all his fancy-pants gadgets and sensors now and has been taken off his brute strength.
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The Shuruku Demon

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2019, 12:23:33 PM »
Tony completely owns Peter here.
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/60199/2010498-1076102_scan0019_super.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11114/111142536/4140575-scan0020-1.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/60199/2010500-1076105_scan0021_super.jpg

That's effectively a prep win though, since Tony was exploiting the biometric data he'd gained on Spidey's powers from the Iron Spider suit to to fool Peter's spider-sense, and simulate a spider-sense of his own.

This is when Peter had his spider abilities from the totem. Impressive enough in tanking an
allegedly full power repulsor chest beam (I call bullshit because there's no way Peter should
have tanked it) but Peter has to give everything he has to literally overweb Tony. Although he
does have him immobilized, Tony has the chance to take Peter out during his interrogation
as well as after, but lets him go on account of Aunt May, so this one's a draw.
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/peter-parker-vs-iron-man-one-more-day-1.jpg
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/peter-parker-vs-iron-man-one-more-day-2.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/6jZ5Pe5qwJcz0F5DTiuxxMFoaklglii6zNBZegEw1__MNZIphIAnL836EGo5FGtHsks1Aavj4BA8=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/Brg17DN5GoIubJCrGlVobOQ5UemWnCrT4yMOdotPZYiAVXWX34SkH10EHSL7z_Gvd4KdGsI5O6r9=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/UsYaDKfPasKKJiVq6bg6Y0955H4VjsATnf47iKZIImsCQFEYrRa_bimfVycErGaWLufEi-JnKnmf=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/s3LzvpiguKaPFKsxudefzUThNDWjO_6V5iPmcbyfR8KcrRdZ9B0OqLAOhHRr9RNIqaliXcpa0Cii=s1600

Considering that Peter could easily have put his fist through Tony's exposed face in this one, this proves that this version of Peter definitely had the ability to take Iron Man down. He also showed that he was capable of punching a hole through Tony's faceplate.





Only lost here because Peter had previously hacked his armor. Prior to it kicking in, Peter is looking
worse for the wear against him, while Tony is pretty much fine.
https://2static1.fjcdn.com/comments/Blank+_da53fa9f36bc32dac005ebbca48a9f36.jpg
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-1250229d6af0a249a342896580736f2f
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11124/111240936/4991414-2381485842-20109.jpg

That's from a What If...?, so I wouldn't count it, especially considering we have multiple canon fights to go on.

Mostly Tony beating Peter who gets in one shot and then has his armor turned off. Webs up Tony
and then runs. So right here, Peter is forced to retreat, which counts as a win for Tony. This is with
Peter in the Iron Spider Suit btw, not standard Spider-Man.
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/CvhGdtERkjH35G8lfPk_pZz9EAsIrHbthhUQxom95rvdyjeGLZw0zr3rKSVyp_h6KSmIYX3ENeVg=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/TcK2aH8z7FzvXN_DNbl-B9qUOV82x8XjpKdp8j6jTwWGylwY2zv-SkVUOindNVo_iBasd7bBc7LQ=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/wl-_bpegHfZvuftU9NqkELpBP1acKW3NW1rOZCrdVox4v7wQTyv6fAkKaQVjF56AnvgqfFbgd5gz=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/EMhKW86t7qMUnGRJi5IXjwZzh_nA2VYAXVm8xnudTmuA55PV6jSsGqOw3eIkUi3NPhfj15YCxD2K=s1600
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/zjSN2D9VkSG-10G-p4LWidaxdXfviW5CkCI5Py0Hf0Rnqw8BxBcJFGmk6KC2rU_hyzY77zCQ29Pv=s1600

Another Iron Spider fight. Well, not much of one. He gets one hit on Tony, then dodges some blasts
before running into reinforced glass. All Peter can do here is fight defensively.
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/iron-spidey-vs-iron-man-civil-war-1.jpg
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/iron-spidey-vs-iron-man-civil-war-2.jpg
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/iron-spidey-vs-iron-man-civil-war-3.jpg
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/iron-spidey-vs-iron-man-civil-war-4.jpg

So in total
1. Normal Spider-Man has 1 win (via prep) and one loss
2. Iron Spider has no conclusive fights, but looks to be more on the wear than Tony in the fights.
3. Totem Spider-Man has one draw.

Keep in mind that Tony seems to hold back a lot against Peter. Rhodey isn't close to Parker in
the same way and wouldn't be as inclined to.

You didn't include the clean win Peter scored over Tony in AMAZING SPIDER-MAN: WHO AM I? #1. I'm only posting the last three pages here, since the whole fight was around 40 pages long due to the web comic format, but you can read the whole fight at the link below.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Amazing-Spider-Man-Who-Am-I/Full-Part-1?id=90021#130







The Shuruku Demon

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2019, 12:42:40 PM »
I think we can all agree that Spider-Man (as we have seen in several issues) can't beat Iron Man. He can deliver some damage, he has even escaped an angry Iron Man, hell he somehow even defeated Iron Man 2020! But the standard Tony Stark in modern armor? Nah.

However, how about War Machine? Who gets the majority.

Peter can and has beaten Tony, as shown above. He's obviously the underdog, and I give Tony 8/10 overall, but Peter's record against him isn't consistent with him being incapable of winning.

As for War Machine, I imagine the odds would be about the same. They did tangle briefly shortly after Civil War, when Rhodey was sent to depower Peter using Tony's S.P.I.N. tech. Here are the scans.



















Red Exodus

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2019, 06:00:12 PM »
That's effectively a prep win though, since Tony was exploiting the biometric data he'd gained on Spidey's powers from the Iron Spider suit to to fool Peter's spider-sense, and simulate a spider-sense of his own.

Fair enough.

Quote
Considering that Peter could easily have put his fist through Tony's exposed face in this one, this proves that this version of Peter definitely had the ability to take Iron Man down. He also showed that he was capable of punching a hole through Tony's faceplate.

Under normal circumstances? No.

He's already punched Tony before and didn't do any damage, so the fact that he did what he did
is 100% bullshit. Considering the weight class Tony falls under, I somehow doubt Peter can punch
harder than Wonder Man, Hulk, and other heavy hitters that have no doubt punched Tony in his
face without completely crushing it.

And as he stated, he spent everything on that massive webb attack that he himself did not know
he could do.

Granted, Iron Man is blasting him and wasn't somehow able to put him down before getting
webbed up, so all in all, the scene that went down is some hard PIS.

Quote
That's from a What If...?, so I wouldn't count it, especially considering we have multiple canon fights to go on.

That I did not know, so I am inclined to agree with you.

Quote
You didn't include the clean win Peter scored over Tony in AMAZING SPIDER-MAN: WHO AM I? #1. I'm only posting the last three pages here, since the whole fight was around 40 pages long due to the web comic format, but you can read the whole fight at the link below.

I did not know about this fight. Nothing in Google turned up when I was looking for Iron Man/Spider-Man
fights.

Still, that remains one of the worst fights I've ever had the misfortune of reading. Aside from the irrelevant
to the discussion, but needing to be brought up dogshit level of dialogue, the fight is laughably one sided.
Tony barely gets a hit in, Peter completely dominates the fight, and Tony does not at all fight smart or in a
way that we have seen him fight in the past.

That aside, the fight is stupidly inconsistent. Tony no sells a kick to the face, but reacts to getting an
elbow? He blasts Peter with Repulsor Rays and Peter doesn't react at all (nor does he you know, dodge
the attack, which he should've been able to. It's not like Tony was right in front of him), but reacts to
another blast later on.

If we are counting this fight, let's be sure to include how unbelievably bullshit it is. It's an extreme low
for Tony.

As for the scans of War Machine, I wouldn't count it. They have no interaction at all with the exception
of Peter webbing up Rhodey's Shoulder Cannon, which Rhodey remarked on being a crazy shot. Not
enough was shown there to really build on anything. No fight takes place between the two. (Also, it's
stupid that the web gums up his cannon and it requires a total reboot? What the fuck? He has OTHER
weapons he could use).

Besides, the one doing all the fighting is Komodo.

ProjectCornDog

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2019, 12:55:19 PM »
JAYSUS at some of these scans!!

The Shuruku Demon

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2019, 03:00:17 PM »
Considering that Peter could easily have put his fist through Tony's exposed face in this one, this proves that this version of Peter definitely had the ability to take Iron Man down. He also showed that he was capable of punching a hole through Tony's faceplate.

Under normal circumstances? No.

He's already punched Tony before and didn't do any damage, so the fact that he did what he did is 100% bullshit. Considering the weight class Tony falls under, I somehow doubt Peter can punch harder than Wonder Man, Hulk, and other heavy hitters that have no doubt punched Tony in his face without completely crushing it.

And as he stated, he spent everything on that massive webb attack that he himself did not know he could do.

Granted, Iron Man is blasting him and wasn't somehow able to put him down before getting
webbed up, so all in all, the scene that went down is some hard PIS.

PIS or not, facts are facts, and feats are feats. Peter punched a hole through Iron Man armour there, and he's managed that in three unrelated stories under three different writers. When a character repeatedly shows the ability to do a given thing, I stop worrying about whether it makes sense or not, and start accepting that that's just the way things are.

You didn't include the clean win Peter scored over Tony in AMAZING SPIDER-MAN: WHO AM I? #1. I'm only posting the last three pages here, since the whole fight was around 40 pages long due to the web comic format, but you can read the whole fight at the link below.

I did not know about this fight. Nothing in Google turned up when I was looking for Iron Man/Spider-Man
fights.

Still, that remains one of the worst fights I've ever had the misfortune of reading. Aside from the irrelevant to the discussion, but needing to be brought up dogshit level of dialogue, the fight is laughably one sided. Tony barely gets a hit in, Peter completely dominates the fight, and Tony does not at all fight smart or in a way that we have seen him fight in the past.

That aside, the fight is stupidly inconsistent. Tony no sells a kick to the face, but reacts to getting an elbow? He blasts Peter with Repulsor Rays and Peter doesn't react at all (nor does he you know, dodge the attack, which he should've been able to. It's not like Tony was right in front of him), but reacts to another blast later on.

If we are counting this fight, let's be sure to include how unbelievably bullshit it is. It's an extreme low for Tony.

It's a bad day for Tony, no question, but there shouldn't be any question that it counts since it's canon.

As for the scans of War Machine, I wouldn't count it. They have no interaction at all with the exception of Peter webbing up Rhodey's Shoulder Cannon, which Rhodey remarked on being a crazy shot. Not enough was shown there to really build on anything. No fight takes place between the two. (Also, it's stupid that the web gums up his cannon and it requires a total reboot? What the fuck? He has OTHER
weapons he could use).

Besides, the one doing all the fighting is Komodo.

I don't see anything wrong with the War Machine scene. Seems reasonable that a load of nanites backfiring and invading his armours key systems would lead to malfunctions, and require something like a reboot to fix. It doesn't tell us much about how a typical fight between Spidey and Rhodey would go, since Rhodey wouldn't be equipped with S.P.I.N. tech normally, but the fact that Peter could cause one of his shoulder cannons to backfire like that helps Peter's case for being able to give him some problems.

Uhtceare

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2019, 05:49:41 PM »






That kind of strength looks like it should be beyond Spider-Man's ability to affect, but it's Marvel's flagship character. Marvel's flagship character aint losing to Iron Man's sidekick, no matter how little sense it makes.

The Shuruku Demon

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Re: War Machine vs Spider-Man
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2019, 06:23:26 PM »
The way I look at it, the power level of comicbook characters is elastic rather than static, and the fluctuations often correlate with the power level of the opponent. As such, Iron Man isn't going to be portrayed in line with his high end showings when he fights a relative lightweight like Spider-Man, just as Spidey isn't portrayed in line with his high end showings when he fights Punisher or Daredevil.