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So is Biden fucked

Imperial

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #15 on: April 02, 2019, 12:13:43 AM »
Beto has a lot of time to get better. But he'll have to do just that. And get quite a bit more specific. I'd be fairly surprised if he ( or anyone ) can platitude their way to the White House in 2020. I guess there could be one more election in that direction left, but..............eh. I would not want to bank on it anymore.

The political inside types were completely off in 2016. They seem to be slow to recognize that we are in the early stages of a changing of the guards. Obama also had the First Black President factor for him. Which was significant. Along with an opponent that picked Sarah Palin.
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Imperial

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2019, 12:23:22 AM »
As for Biden, he has * a lot * of baggage.

The bankruptcy bill. Anita Hill. The Iraq War vote. Support of the Clinton's various deregulation schemes of the 90's. NAFTA. The Crime Bill. The busing issue. 

He has not upped his awareness game enough over the years either imo. Not when he does not seem to recognize that today's GOP is a vastly different animal than the one it was when he was a young Senator. It doesn't help that he kicked the largest age voting block in the teeth either.

I get why he did not run in 2016. But I think that might have been Joe's last good chance. Every year that passes sees voters who relate to his outlook being a less and less important part of the overall population.
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Not BAMF

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #17 on: April 04, 2019, 08:49:25 AM »
Biden and Bernie can't win.

I think the Dems' best chance is probably Beto. Maybe Warren.
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AP

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #18 on: April 04, 2019, 09:01:18 AM »
I think Bernie can win as long as the Dems don't shoot themselves in the foot.

ProjectCornDog

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #19 on: April 04, 2019, 09:39:29 AM »
Bernie probably wouldnt win in a normal fair primary where all the states vote around the same time.

In a nonsensical primary system that gives so much weight to Iowa, New Hampshire, etc, it allows guys like Bernie with the capital and momentum to focus and get such an advantage that it becomes his race to lose (meaning he needs to fuck up debates, etc).

Biden supported the Iraq war, was the most powerful Democrat during the Anita Hill hearing and did nothing, on the record had abhorrent views on segregation, and now creepy uncle Joe. He isnt winning this IMO.

therock

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #20 on: April 04, 2019, 11:50:57 AM »
Biden and Bernie can't win.

I think the Dems' best chance is probably Beto. Maybe Warren.

Why do you think Bernie can't win

Biden doing well in the polls. Think Trump is the few people who can't attack him on some of this stuff. Sure he can try and be hypocrtical about it but it be to obviously silly for him of all people to attack

It be like Scareface telling you, "you have a drug problem and I can't respect anymore with a drug problem" while he scrooge mcducking his way through a pile of cocaine

AP

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #21 on: April 04, 2019, 12:11:03 PM »
Bernie probably wouldnt win in a normal fair primary where all the states vote around the same time.

Why not?  He hasn't had any scandals and he's still one fo the most popular politicians in the country?  The only thing that holds him back is the establishment being against him.

Not BAMF

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #22 on: April 04, 2019, 12:53:37 PM »
I think a lot of the passion around Bernie has cooled in the last few years. I thoroughly believe he WOULD have won in 2016, but now he's fighting being four years older and all the accusations of sexism in his campaign and how he never reeled anything in. Also, from what I have heard, most minorities aren't super hot for him. I think he missed (or got screwed out of) his window. I was all about Bernie, too, and I still dig him, but I just don't see him as a viable candidate this time.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 12:57:30 PM by Not BAMF »
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AP

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #23 on: April 04, 2019, 01:46:16 PM »
Good point.

Imperial

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #24 on: April 04, 2019, 02:39:31 PM »
Judging from the number of people that have donated to him already, including a large number that had not donated before, I really don't see empirical evidence that Sanders is not viable this time. I mean, the election can go in any direction this early on. Maybe he will lose heat. That though can be said about almost anybody. When you've got even biased against economic progressive "mainstream" media outlets kind of admitting that Sanders has done a good job of maintaining momentum............

The media loves hinting the "So many have adopted Bernie's ideas that Bernie isn't needed anymore" idea. But is Bernie's message and history really going to fail to connect in places like Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Iowa, etc? 

I'd vote for Warren myself. Liz is fine with me. But I'm not sure of any currently plausible rout that would suggest she matches up better with Trump than Sanders does. The native American controversy was more damaging to her than accusations were to Sanders, afaik.
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nu-safado

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #25 on: April 04, 2019, 03:53:14 PM »
Bernie is a good candidate on is talking points but I think he's out-of-touch.

If the economy dips into a slight recession before the election, which is more likely than not, than how anxious will people be to hear about big government spending and railing against Wall Street.

Bernie is good to galvanize the tribe, in 2016, the election was about the people being tired of technocratic establishment figures not caring about middle-America's problems and the wealthy cannibalizing the nation's institutions while gaming the system towards disaster.

It's hard for an incumbent to lose in a surging economy and no major wars.

A cyclical recession would leave Trump vulnerable. I don't think this election will be about populism though, and that means Bernie's platform will be short on details, and he'll be a 76-year old man yelling about Wall Street when there's plenty of youngbloods who have similar ideas and more policy experience.

I know Bernie has been an elected official forever, but he doesn't have Elizabeth Warren's policy wonk knowledge of health care or Beto O'Rourke's political skill etc.......

It's a hard road ahead for him at least in terms of the Presidency

Imperial

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #26 on: April 04, 2019, 04:10:29 PM »
If the economy dips into a recession, who is going to be largely hurt most by that? The middle, working, and poorer classes. If anything, railing against insiders and presenting programs meant to aid the above will likely be an even better strategy in that case. Of course, Trump will attempt that too. But since it will have happened on his watch, he would have to deal with such too.

For example, when more people are unable to get the healthcare they need to avoid being pushed onto the street or dying, the call to majorly alter said system will grow louder. Get elected but continue to largely uphold status quo? You and your party are going to suffer for it. Especially if it is the Dems. The modern GOP can play a bigger portion of their base with "It's those immigrants."
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nu-safado

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #27 on: April 04, 2019, 09:34:23 PM »
Well, yeah. If the recession cycle hits and Trump's base is ht he's out

Incumbents can usually beat anything but a recession unless the country is rallying behind a war. Even if Trump had a war, he would bungle it badly and it would be his base going off to fight it

If the recession hits I think Trump is out

Next step would be that Dems assume the Presidency, but likely not the Senat and keep Congress. I read 538.com and apparently, the electoral map favors Repubs in the near-future Senate races

Then it would and should be on to healthcare. IMO - it will come down to a lot of yelling about Medicare and Medicaid

I think that's a mistake, but a huge portion of baby boomers are going to retire soon and gain benefits and they're going to vote to get more benefits

In the meanwhile, the real issue with healthcare is that no private sector company is trying to build a benefits-based system - i.e rewards for healthy behavior or rewarding better patient outcomes

Jeff Bezon, Jamie Dimon (JP Morgan CEO) and Warren Buffet have a lot to say about that. I really want to hear what those guys have to say on it

The government not negotiating the prices of drug buys is insane - INSANE!!!!!!

Spiking prices for drugs like INSULIN and basic heart and cancer drugs is just mind-boggling to me.

With the baby boomers getting medicare, maybe this can change


therock

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #28 on: April 04, 2019, 10:48:47 PM »
Kind of like Booker idea that if a drug company overcharged on a drug to a crazy amount they lose the copyright so other places can sale generic versions of the drugs

Imperial

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Re: So is Biden fucked
« Reply #29 on: April 04, 2019, 11:44:54 PM »
If America has to depend on the Baby Boomer Generation of voters and their style of politicians to straighten things out............well...............that is rather depressing.  :'(
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