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Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents

Tjackflash

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Re: Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents
« Reply #15 on: March 28, 2019, 08:37:33 PM »
Granted, I never said that this wasn’t a monumental human error screwup.  I just don’t know what policy could have been changed to keep it from happening again.
'cause justice is the one thing you should always find.

AP

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Re: Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents
« Reply #16 on: March 28, 2019, 08:41:33 PM »
Granted, I never said that this wasn’t a monumental human error screwup.  I just don’t know what policy could have been changed to keep it from happening again.

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MTL76

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Re: Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents
« Reply #17 on: March 28, 2019, 09:08:14 PM »
Granted, I never said that this wasn’t a monumental human error screwup.  I just don’t know what policy could have been changed to keep it from happening again.

A good first step would be for this doctor to be investigated by his state's office of professional medical conduct. The article may be leaving out information, which an investigation would uncover. But based on what was reported, his behavior and judgement are suspect. Having a medical degree doesn't give someone the right to play Gestapo or run roughshod over the autonomy of their patients.


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Bran Mak Morn

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Re: Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents
« Reply #18 on: March 28, 2019, 09:48:55 PM »
     
As to Bran Mak Morn, there is no such database and unfortunately America is going through one of it’s occasional case of the stupids and people are believing that childhood vaccinations are bad.  This is leading to people sending kids to schools and daycares who are infected with diseases that should have been wiped out decades ago.


When a child is born in Australia, one of the 1st things the hospital does is to issue the parents with an official diary commonly called, The Blue Book. It's basically a book that includes the child's birth details & then a list of dates throughout their 1st 7 years of when vac shots are due & needed. When the vac shots are done, the doctor certifies the book. The book is also used to record the various ailments a child might go through & is ideally brought to every medical appointment in case it's a different doctor or hospital/medical centre.

When the child is old enough to enrol in pre-school or possibly travelling o/s, the parent is required to present the Blue Book.

The Blue Book is essentially juz for the parents' sake of keeping track. All the info in the book is initially recorded in the hospital's database & easily accessible no matter if you move states or simply choose to go to another medical centre.
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Tjackflash

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Re: Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents
« Reply #19 on: March 28, 2019, 09:56:19 PM »
     
As to Bran Mak Morn, there is no such database and unfortunately America is going through one of it’s occasional case of the stupids and people are believing that childhood vaccinations are bad.  This is leading to people sending kids to schools and daycares who are infected with diseases that should have been wiped out decades ago.




When a child is born in Australia, one of the 1st things the hospital does is to issue the parents with an official diary commonly called, The Blue Book. It's basically a book that includes the child's birth details & then a list of dates throughout their 1st 7 years of when vac shots are due & needed. When the vac shots are done, the doctor certifies the book. The book is also used to record the various ailments a child might go through & is ideally brought to every medical appointment in case it's a different doctor or hospital/medical centre.

When the child is old enough to enrol in pre-school or possibly travelling o/s, the parent is required to present the Blue Book.

The Blue Book is essentially juz for the parents' sake of keeping track. All the info in the book is initially recorded in the hospital's database & easily accessible no matter if you move states or simply choose to go to another medical centre.

   A sensible thing.   I’m getting off this topic, it makes me sad and there are too many things here and elsewhere that make me happy.
'cause justice is the one thing you should always find.

Bran Mak Morn

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Re: Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents
« Reply #20 on: March 28, 2019, 10:15:44 PM »
I think we can adequately protect children who are truly at risk without allowing for gross abuses of power by the government. The first step towards that is accountability for the people who created this situation: the doctor who exaggerated the severity of this situation and clearly overstepped his professional bounds, and the staff at the child protective services who ordered that the children be removed. Of course, this will never happen. I understand that once the court order to remove the children was obtained, the cops were in a bind.

When my kid was first learning to walk, he lost his balance & fell hitting his head on the edge of the coffee table.
A small gash, lots of blood & a trip to the children's hospital.

The triage nurse first ascertained that he didn't have concussion & would require "gluing" the gash together as he was too young (& skin too thin) for stitching...

Instead of telling us to go wait back in the reception room with all the other parents & children, the nursing staff led us to a small examination room & closed the door without giving reason or even saying a word.

My kid was restless, cranky & in a little pain & I was doing my best to keep him distracted from touching the cut on his forehead. His mom sat close by & we had a laid back conversation wondering when the nurse or doctor was coming back...

We were in that room for about 15 minutes before I spotted a miniature camera & mic hidden in the wall facing us.
I realised we had been placed in the room for surveillance. Basically to catch if one or both of us had deliberately caused the cut & we were "getting our facts straight" with each other.

I was angry & felt ashamed that they considered the incident as suspicious.
But I also had to realise that there as some sick fucks out there hurting children & the hospital had a duty of care to their patients.
"It's like trying to teach a pig to sing.
It won't work & you just end up annoying the pig."
-Judge Judy.

Bran Mak Morn

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Re: Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents
« Reply #21 on: March 28, 2019, 10:57:29 PM »
https://www.google.com/amp/s/reason.com/blog/2019/03/27/sick-2-year-old-swat-team-dcs-parents/amp


Fuck this. Fuck the media.
I keep forgetting that one simple mantra, "Don't Believe The Hype."

I firstly ignored how biased & sarcastic this article was written & tried to focus on the facts to give my opinion.
I blamed the doctor because the journalist stated the doctor was "uncertain" if the child was vaccinated...

Another article from another media source (KMC, Anti-vax Movement thread in Gen Forum Discussion) states the mother hadn't vaccinated the 2 yr old child & was reluctant on the doctors advice for further tests because she was worried about the repercussions.

I take back my blaming the doctor & officially stop giving a shit about this incident.
"It's like trying to teach a pig to sing.
It won't work & you just end up annoying the pig."
-Judge Judy.

GeneralPresidentSkeletor

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Re: Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents
« Reply #22 on: April 22, 2019, 11:45:03 PM »
Just thought I'd chime in and dispel a bit of the "baby snatcher" fear mongering.

If the cops were called 1st by the doctor, THEY called CPS because the situation involved children that would HAVE to be detained if both parents were being arrested or there was sufficient immediate potential harm. CPS would then come out to the scene and assess the situation for safety concerns, and then they would only detain the child(ren) if necessary. If possible, an extended family member or responsible adult in the family (an adult sibling, for example) present could have the child(ren) surrendered to him/her at the scene, or he/she would be contacted in the hopes of doing an emergency family placement. This practice was put in place to better serve the families of detained children, but often the family member in question can't pass the background check or doesn't follow through with a small bit of paperwork (and I do mean only a little bit), or their home inspection comes up unsafe. Or, the family just doesn't want to deal with it, in which case a licensed foster home is contacted and used for placement, however long it may be. Depending upon how things shake out, the emergency placement could last a few days, or a few weeks. The latter only happens if the case becomes a full-on CPS case, requiring quite a bit of legal checks and balances (CPS would have to demonstrate to a judge sufficient reason, generally). There's quite a bit more that happens after that, like the parent(s) working a case plan to demonstrate a Changed Situation, leading to reunification, but every situation or reason for detainment is different. Unsecured weapons in the home are an immediate, actionable reason due to the massive potential for harm they represent and it sounds like Arizona isn't doing itself any favors with the whole "we're rebel cowboys, pew pew" thing.

If the doc called CPS 1st, a worker has to respond and do a wellness check within 10 days (emergency response workers are great at weeding out bullshit calls; trust me on this). A social worker will make contact, visit the home or children in school (depends on what was reported) and go from there. Detainment is not a knee-jerk thing; there HAS to be demonstrable and thusly documented concern, which 90% falls under neglect (ex: no food in the home, child comes to school wearing the same dirty clothing several days in a row, things like that). If the CPS worker feels he/she needs police back up to mitigate the removal process, they'll be called to ensure everyone's safety.

Children can't just be removed from a home willy-nilly. There are a great number of laws and codes of conduct a CPS worker has to abide by, but if a case is opened for a family, it becomes a different situation entirely. The laws for social work are virtually the same, state-to-state, but not all counties are run as well as they could be. I will say from first-hand experience, both from working with children for nearly 20 years, having a therapeutic foster home license for about 15 years and my wife being an actual social worker for over a decade, the people that have had a "bad experience" with CPS are, generally, the people whom absolutely should not have children in any way, shape or form under their roof. Are there bad parents? Sure...but "bad" parents don't have CPS cases opened up and lose their parental rights to their children, the AWFUL, HORRIBLE, ABUSIVE parents do, and they talk the most shit while doing the least amount of work possible (if any) to reunify with their children.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2019, 11:46:42 PM by GeneralPresidentSkeletor »

GeneralPresidentSkeletor

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Re: Doctor calls SWAT team on children’s parents
« Reply #23 on: April 22, 2019, 11:53:23 PM »
Also, the whole process to remove parental rights is long and arduous. Differs from state-to-state, but you can bank on a year or more before that happens, and that ONLY happens if there is a permanent plan, like adoption, in place. There are a lot of hearings and a lot of visits and a case plan managed by a team of people (doctors, lawyers, judges, social workers, the parents, family etc) before it comes to that. It's rare that parental rights are removed any quicker than that, like both parents going to prison for more than 6 months or both parents dying, and again the rights are only removed so that the child(ren) can then be legally adopted.