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Tulsi Gabbard is running for President

therock

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2019, 12:11:11 PM »
They are mad at fake liberals being corporate shills and war-mongers.  As long as they avoid doing that, everything should be fine.

Question is will they pain people like Warren as that. Shill get tossed around a lot

AP

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2019, 03:09:20 PM »
I can't think of a time when shill wasn't applied correctly by a large group of people.

therock

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2019, 04:05:57 PM »
well what would you consider a large group of people because heard it tossed around to people who may not deserve

I want a Bernie, Warren. or Tulsa to win

but my fear is there can base at sometimes can get how we say overzealous and might make small difference or fault seem like huge one and may eat each other alive, allowing a Biden to waltz in.

or if one if them win the nom. the other groups in the progressive sides may hate each other

ProjectCornDog

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #18 on: January 12, 2019, 04:33:15 PM »
As someone who voted for Rand Paul last election and then Gary Johnson in the general, Tulsi Gabbard is seriously someone I'd consider voting for.

Imperial

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #19 on: January 13, 2019, 01:27:18 AM »
Tulsi has been my top pick for a while.  The Dems will likely try to screw her over and we’ll end up with Trump for four more years.


This, or the nation will see Biden or a like corporate Dem shill win. Who then does what corporate sell outs do, promptly leading to a Republican wave in 2022. Followed by President Pence/Cruz/Haley/Ryan in 2024. Effectively ending any pretense of American Democracy. Or first world status for many/most of it's citizens. 

But even then, the talking heads won't get it. By then, Dem bigwigs and mainstream media will be telling Americans about how Dems need to look to the days of "reasonable" ala The Clintons, Joe Donnelly, and Joseph Lieberman for guidance. To "save" America. When it is they who have helped craft the images of Reagan and Clinton. Who covered for the massive lies of Bush, Cheney, and the nation's war machine. And without whose help Trump would not be President right now.
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Propeus The Fallen

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #20 on: January 13, 2019, 01:32:45 AM »
...you voted for that burnt out pot head? That's even worse than crazy green party lady!!!

And forget Warren, when you almost make Trump right about something, you've lost my support.

And yeah, I want someone closer to my generation to win. I'm hoping we can pull out another Obama defeat the top contender type. And...we actually have some really good contender so far.

And if Biden does win--I hope to god he isn't as stupid as Hillary and picks a lame ass VP like Tim Kaine and goes with someone popular.


And to stay on topic.

https://thehill.com/homenews/media/425065-rashida-tlaibs-profane-call-to-impeach-trump-got-5-times-more-cable-news

Fox News...amazing.

Imperial

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #21 on: January 13, 2019, 01:39:52 AM »
If Biden wins, America loses no matter who wins the general.

It's basically the difference between being devoured quickly and violently ( Trump. ) Or being slowly strangled to death ( "not middle class" Joe. )
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therock

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #22 on: January 13, 2019, 03:43:42 AM »
...you voted for that burnt out pot head? That's even worse than crazy green party lady!!!

And forget Warren, when you almost make Trump right about something, you've lost my support.

And yeah, I want someone closer to my generation to win. I'm hoping we can pull out another Obama defeat the top contender type. And...we actually have some really good contender so far.

And if Biden does win--I hope to god he isn't as stupid as Hillary and picks a lame ass VP like Tim Kaine and goes with someone popular.


And to stay on topic.

https://thehill.com/homenews/media/425065-rashida-tlaibs-profane-call-to-impeach-trump-got-5-times-more-cable-news

Fox News...amazing.

Think people make to big of a deal out of native thing. Because people who wont vote for her because of that probally ween't going to vote for her anyway. It not like people were going "Well was going to votea against the racist moron who I mostly disagree with...but that poconhontos thing really swayed me"

Namely they MOUTAINS and moutains of BS trump got 100 percent wrong, or just pulled out of his ass

It dont mind Joe that much. He seem perfect find on a lot of issues. If it Biden vs Trump.  But lean toward Bernie, or Tulsa becaue their better canidate. For any other reason that Biden Voter will still Vote for Bernie...cant say the same Vice Versa

Would go for Tulsa over all of them though. She young and has a foreign policy backround that will help. But Hope people who running against Biden don't undestimate him because he got a many thing that will help him. People think it will be only a DNC that could help him win. But he got a couple of things going for him that could help him win even if the DNc

1) Obama. Obama Will come out for him pretty stongly. Stonger then he did for Hillary..since he now not president.. And will have his coalition with him. Also Obama extemel popular with dems. Which helpfull since its a dem primary
2) So far has the miniroy vote. That can change but right now has it pretty good
3) Can Dig into the Rural white Voter that Bernie has
4) Has a lot of the moderates supports
5) You can't use the well the POLLS say I will do better then Biden agianst Trump Argument
6) Pretty popular with dems..which imporatn since again it a dem nomination
7) Harder to pant as an evil monster as Hillary..since it not decade of research
8) Generaly well like by the media. And actully pretty like by the public. That why he got that uncle Joe. It no stories of him have a death list or any shit like that
9) Has a penis...always helpfull like it or not
10) And can play rural down home politics

So hope people aint underesitmating this guy. Also if you want to beat him for the love of fuck have a stragedy against any southern wall he will have.  It wont all be caucus states. If he wins...the vote. Need to pick Tulsa, Bernie, or Warrne or someone like that

In fact if any of those 3 win they may have to pick one another. a Tulsa Bernie ticket would be extremly storng

Ojeda may not have a chance.

AP

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #23 on: January 13, 2019, 05:29:21 AM »
If Biden wins, America loses no matter who wins the general.

It's basically the difference between being devoured quickly and violently ( Trump. ) Or being slowly strangled to death ( "not middle class" Joe. )

Pretty much.

Propeus The Fallen

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #24 on: January 13, 2019, 09:06:50 AM »
Um, Biden's not that bad. I mean, he did a lot of good with The Obama Administration. Heck, a lot of gay rights that happened was because of Biden.

And he actually is a good person. And the real difference is a reasonable intelligent adult vs a psychopathic manchild who is a possible traitor to his country.

Of course, it could be I just don't care because whoever the Dems put out will be automatically be better than Trump.

ProjectCornDog

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #25 on: January 13, 2019, 09:16:24 AM »
Um, Biden's not that bad. I mean, he did a lot of good with The Obama Administration. Heck, a lot of gay rights that happened was because of Biden.

And he actually is a good person. And the real difference is a reasonable intelligent adult vs a psychopathic manchild who is a possible traitor to his country.

Of course, it could be I just don't care because whoever the Dems put out will be automatically be better than Trump.

It was often behind the scenes where the Obama administration turned back on their campaign promises and became less than desirable politicians.

Obama and Biden ran against the PATRIOT Act...only to have the massive surveillance state expanded to untold heights (as revealed by the whole Edward Snowden situation). He ran against the Iraq war and came off as less hawkish than his Republican cohorts, only to expand the military reach into places like Yemen, Syria, and Libya. Obama once said increasing the debt 4 trillion was unpatriotic, well he added over 9 trillion.

In the public eye, they came off like responsible diplomatic adults whose goal was to unite the American people. Their policies however rarely did that. I would argue (as many observers would), the Trump-era is largely in response to the Obama administration.

therock

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #26 on: January 13, 2019, 11:25:40 AM »
Well part of that debt was putting that Bush war cost actully on the books.  And the stimilus package, and getting out of the recession. All massivly expensive.. A stimilus package if anything. Then the Auto bailout. And he did lower the annual deficiet at the end.

https://www.thebalance.com/national-debt-under-obama-3306293

 Also take two sides to unite.



And if people want to do the progressive things they asking for that is going to add a lot to the debt at least in the mean time. But he wasn't running a tear the wall down. He was the team of rivals I will work with the other side guy. A stragedy that probally wouldnt fly if you ran on that now. Also always said afganstan was the good war.

Trump campaign may of been a response to Obama...but Trump actully got handed a county in much better shape then Obama. And it not like it was a huge win.  Trump won with 3 millon less votes then his compentitiion who ran a shitty campaign. Also isn't any new president almost always a response to the last president

Noe the patriot and the drones were a betrayal. So agree with that. But wonder how many people who actully voted for Trump gave a shit about those two things. But in general  Obama was pretty good namely when you compare him to most of the presidents.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2019, 12:10:52 PM by therock »

Imperial

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #27 on: January 13, 2019, 12:47:43 PM »
Um, Biden's not that bad. I mean, he did a lot of good with The Obama Administration. Heck, a lot of gay rights that happened was because of Biden.

And he actually is a good person. And the real difference is a reasonable intelligent adult vs a psychopathic manchild who is a possible traitor to his country.

Of course, it could be I just don't care because whoever the Dems put out will be automatically be better than Trump.

The corporate Dems usually emphasize things like gay rights, abortion, or even just returning to protocol or manners. That way they can sell the notion they are the good guys while not actually doing much to address longterm problems or upset the wealthy donor system.

It doesn't help that he signed off on almost all of Bill Clinton's errors of the 90's. Or that the few statements he's made in recent years suggest he is pretty tone deaf about where the nation is going.

Biden 2020 is a road to a GOP wave in 2022. ( Possibly including a super majority in the senate. ) Likely followed by President Cruz or Haley ( or someone similarly odious ) in 2024.
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Uhtceare

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #28 on: January 13, 2019, 03:03:51 PM »

The corporate Dems usually emphasize things like gay rights, abortion, or even just returning to protocol or manners. That way they can sell the notion they are the good guys while not actually doing much to address longterm problems or upset the wealthy donor system.



Pretty much. The Dem neoliberals are pretty much what the leftwing of the Republican party was from the Lincoln through Eisenhower era. They are rich corporate types who are liberal on those issues that don't threaten their economic power and privilege.

Y'know, it's common wisdom that the Republicans and Democrats switched political allegiances during the Civil Rights era. That's not quite accurate.

 Rather, the Republicans used to be an awkward alliance of all the rich, both the hard-right borderline Nazi rich, and the rich who were liberal on some social issues like a woman's right to vote, and environmental conservation. The result was that the Republican party was very wobbly on social issues as each wing waxed and waned in their influence of the party.

 The Democrats used to be an awkward alliance of all the poor. That included both working class whites(who were mostly racists, especially in the South) and various racial minorities. That alliance was awkward as hell, and mostly survived because local politics and national politics were more distinct back then. It was perfectly possible for a racist Democratic congressman from Mississippi and a liberal Democratic congressman from New York to both vote to end child-labor, for example, even if those same congressmen would have diametrically opposed policies as governors of their respective states.

That changed in the civil rights era, but it wasn't as simple as everyone switching names. Rather, the economically conservative/socially liberal Republicans moved to the Democratic party, and the most viciously racist blue-collar whites moved to the Republican party.

The economically conservative/socially liberal former Republicans(now known as "neoliberals") took over the Democratic party, and the rich Republicans kept their control over the Republican party while throwing bones to their new poor racist members.

The result was that both Democratic and Republican parties were now controlled by the rich. There hasn't been a party that actually represents the poor since the civil rights era.
 

AP

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard is running for President
« Reply #29 on: January 13, 2019, 03:34:19 PM »
Yeah, let's also not forget Biden helped draft the Patriot Act and that the Obama administration signed off on the NDAA 2012.  Biden is a neoliberal through and through.

I mean, we're supposed to love the guy because he was for gay rights?  Even Trump's pro-gay marriage.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2019, 06:03:29 PM by AP »