Herochat

Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers

The Shuruku Demon

  • ******
  • 2706
  • +33/-7
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2018, 08:01:53 PM »
It'd likely take multiple shots, but provided she's got enough ammo to reload two or three times, she can probably put him down long enough for it to count as a battleboard win.

therock

  • ********
  • 8848
  • +50/-65
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2018, 11:35:35 PM »
Also depends on what Myer durablity exactly

Know he not fully human. But he not Jason level unstoppable either

The Shuruku Demon

  • ******
  • 2706
  • +33/-7
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #17 on: November 09, 2018, 06:46:13 AM »
Also depends on what Myer durablity exactly

Know he not fully human. But he not Jason level unstoppable either

I don't see Michael being put down for long by one shot, but if she keeps firing with a pump-action shotgun, like she did against the T-1000 in the steelworks, that'd probably keep him down long enough to count as a win.

If this fight actually took place as a random encounter (i.e. with Sarah having no prior knowledge of Michael), chances are she'd suspect he was a Terminator and unload on him accordingly.

HalloweenJack

  • ********
  • 9227
  • +36/-8
  • Rowdy AF
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #18 on: November 09, 2018, 05:05:07 PM »
I'd have to think she'd think he was just some guy in a mask at first and shoot him, which would drop him but also drop her guard, if she has no prior knowledge of him. That's a pretty big gap that can be exploited in a situation/environment like this.


Give her more weapons or prep or aid/environmental factors (as she had in ALOT of those encounters with folks above Michael) and she can win it, as it stands with just a shotgun and in an old dark house I don't see her winning

The Shuruku Demon

  • ******
  • 2706
  • +33/-7
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #19 on: November 09, 2018, 07:23:10 PM »
I didn't mean to suggest that Sarah would immediately peg Michael for a Terminator at first sight. But if she witnesses his strength, or shoots him and sees that he doesn't stay down, her first thought is probably going to run to Skynet as an explanation, rather than Samhain or druidic curses.

Michael's general lack of humanity would also play into that; he doesn't emote, and moves a bit like an automaton. I was just rewatching bits of H2, and he didn't even use handles to open doors; he just walks into the doors face-and-chest-first, straight through a sheet of glass in one instance.

The Shuruku Demon

  • ******
  • 2706
  • +33/-7
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #20 on: November 09, 2018, 07:43:12 PM »
As far as the outcome of the fight itself goes, I don't see Michael staying down after one shotgun blast, but if she sees him get up again, then she's probably going to assume he's a Terminator right there, and freely unload on him from that point forward.

The only way Michael can gain the upper hand (assuming Sarah has enough ammo not to quickly run out) is if he manages to sneak up within stabbing range before she can shoot him, or if she's foolish enough to go over and check his pulse or something after gunning him down the first time. I don't see either of those scenarios being the most likely outcome though. I think it's more likely that she'd see him coming, gun him down, keep her distance, then gun him down again if he gets back up, as many times as it takes for him to stay down.

Red Exodus

  • ******
  • 2773
  • +13/-22
  • The one you've been smashing for!
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #21 on: November 10, 2018, 01:43:31 PM »
Didn't Myers get his was beat by shitty busta rhymes?

To be fair, he activated his Flip Mode Squad. And once he does, he gets the real live shit from front to back.

HalloweenJack

  • ********
  • 9227
  • +36/-8
  • Rowdy AF
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #22 on: November 11, 2018, 08:32:17 AM »
I'd stil have to go with Michael Shuruku. I get where you're coming from, I just think the dark environment would favor him given how stealthy he is and he just has to get one good strike in on her whereas she'd need multiple attacks to stop him.

And he definitely opens doors like you or I. He doesn't batter through every door in the series. It just looks cool when the more than human killer does it.

The Shuruku Demon

  • ******
  • 2706
  • +33/-7
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #23 on: November 11, 2018, 12:31:50 PM »
I'd stil have to go with Michael Shuruku. I get where you're coming from, I just think the dark environment would favor him given how stealthy he is and he just has to get one good strike in on her whereas she'd need multiple attacks to stop him.

Laurie and Loomis both managed to survive multiple encounters with him despite that, and I wouldn't consider either of them as formidable as T2-Sarah Connor with a pump-action shotgun.

And he definitely opens doors like you or I. He doesn't batter through every door in the series. It just looks cool when the more than human killer does it.

Sometimes he uses handles (like when he opens car doors, presumably), sometimes he doesn't, like in H2. The main point I was making there is that he moves and behaves a bit like an automaton (throughout the franchise), which increases the likelihood of Sarah thinking he could be a Terminator.

HalloweenJack

  • ********
  • 9227
  • +36/-8
  • Rowdy AF
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #24 on: November 11, 2018, 05:18:47 PM »
I wouldn't consider either of them to be a formidable as her either (though I wouldn't put either of them as formidable as cops he's killed), but the environment definitely does play to his strengths. And as for her thinking he's a Terminator unit she might think that. Except that his movements honestly aren't very Terminator like. The sit up, sure, but beyond that Terms are always a bit more human like and less automaton like as they're infiltration units. Now if she sees him sitting up after a shotgun blast to the chest, yeah she's probably going to lay into him. If he's still there.

I just don't see her getting the shots off she needs to do it. Give her more weapons or prep and yeah she has this. I just see him taking a slight majority here.

AP

  • *****
  • 18792
  • +117/-56
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #25 on: November 11, 2018, 10:39:49 PM »
Now that the poll is over, I can give my two cents (and maybe I should start doing this at the end of every BOTW).

I can see this fight going either way.  I can see Sarah mistaking Michael for a Terminator and acting accordingly.  As long as she keeps him in her sights, she should have no problem pumping him full of lead.  As pointed out, Sarah is more badass than some of the characters who have survived or even beaten Michael.  On the other hand, I can see Michael using the dark factory to his advantage by sneaking around and getting in close.  If he gets within arm's reach of Sarah, it's pretty much game over as he could slash her to pieces or even just smash her face in with his bare hands.  So yeah, I could see either result happening.

therock

  • ********
  • 8848
  • +50/-65
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #26 on: November 11, 2018, 11:21:13 PM »
does she know someone coming after her. Because between Terminator 1 and 2...wasn't it hinted she had some military training from people. She may have skill sneaking around herself in the dark.

The Shuruku Demon

  • ******
  • 2706
  • +33/-7
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #27 on: November 12, 2018, 06:00:37 PM »
I wouldn't consider either of them to be a formidable as her either (though I wouldn't put either of them as formidable as cops he's killed),

Those no-name cops were probably less formidable than Sarah on an individual level as well. They always underestimate Michael, and aren't used to dealing with anything beyond regular felons.

but the environment definitely does play to his strengths. And as for her thinking he's a Terminator unit she might think that. Except that his movements honestly aren't very Terminator like. The sit up, sure, but beyond that Terms are always a bit more human like and less automaton like as they're infiltration units. Now if she sees him sitting up after a shotgun blast to the chest, yeah she's probably going to lay into him. If he's still there.

Yeah, T-800s and T-1000s are pretty human-like in their movements, moreso than Michael. But the fact that Michael doesn't emote or move like a normal human is bound to catch Sarah's eye and make her ponder what else he might be. Any demonstration of his strength or durability will further fuel those suspicions. And she knows there are more than two Terminator models, some of them not as advanced or human-like as the ones she encountered.

I just don't see her getting the shots off she needs to do it. Give her more weapons or prep and yeah she has this. I just see him taking a slight majority here.

A pump-action shotgun will do plenty of damage to Michael. Just look at the holes it was blowing in the T-1000 here. Michael isn't going to be shrugging off many of those. A single direct hit will almost certainly floor him and put him down for a bit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Kug8mJ8WiM

Also, consider that she'd already been stabbed through the shoulder before this scene. Could Michael sneak up on her? Sure, but there's no guarantee that he'll succeed in killing her even if he does. Laurie Strode survived close-quarters exchanges with Michael in both H20 and the new movie, and she's a 57-year-old grandma in the new film.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 06:55:29 PM by The Shuruku Demon »

HalloweenJack

  • ********
  • 9227
  • +36/-8
  • Rowdy AF
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #28 on: November 12, 2018, 07:08:48 PM »
We're just agree to disagree S.D., cause I get what you're saying and I even see your points, but I just don't see her getting it here.

We got a dark area that plays to his strengths, she's going to need multiple attacks to put him down for good, he just needs one good attack here. Granted that's the on paper analysis.

But yeah, no-name cops on average are less than Sarah. No question. Then he goes and takes out an entire police station in Halloween 4. Not to be confused with the Man In Black attacking it in the fifth one.

And yes, as I said, she MIGHT think that based on his movements that he's a Terminator. He doesn't move like one, but it's possible all things considered she might think back to when Kyle told her about the rubber skinned units and think that it might be a lesser unit. She has to see him first though. You have to consider Michael can be standing right next to you at any given time in one of those movies and you'd never know. That's kind of a trademark, the elusive evil. And given the area they're fighting in, that's absolutely one of Michael's advantages.

But if she does put him down, and no doubt she could with the shotgun, the longer it keeps him there the more apt she is to think he's dead, which again works in his favor for when he inevitably does move away when her guard is let down. And we have to take in account the damage done to the T-1000 maybe being due to its liquid metal nature.  Even Sarah with a handgun in their escape from the mental institution is putting pretty sizable holes in the T-1000, not like the shotgun but still pretty large. Also Michael takes a few shots from a similar weapon as well as rifles and handguns at the end of Halloween 4 and doesn't take damage like the T-1000. And while I'm not going to QUANtify this and say that he's not getting his limbs blown off because he's not being hit there, but he does take several direct hits, and while such an attack plus a fall about thirty feet down and nearly drowning (not to mention he just got hit by a truck) does put him for a year, he's not splattered everywhere.

As for the last point, you got lows and highs. Sarah might go toe to toe with him up close, she might get her head twisted off or a finger put through her skull, or even impaled with her own shotgun.

Like I've said, I think she can do it just not in this particular scenario for the majority.

The Shuruku Demon

  • ******
  • 2706
  • +33/-7
    • View Profile
Re: Battle of the Week: Sarah Connor vs Michael Myers
« Reply #29 on: November 13, 2018, 01:17:14 PM »
But yeah, no-name cops on average are less than Sarah. No question. Then he goes and takes out an entire police station in Halloween 4. Not to be confused with the Man In Black attacking it in the fifth one.

I'm very much aware of that scene, and was going to bring it up myself in one of the other recent Myers threads at one point. On balance though, it was a high-end showing for Michael, not what I'd consider his average. It also happened off-screen, so we don't know whether he met much direct resistance, or whether he caught most of them napping.

And yes, as I said, she MIGHT think that based on his movements that he's a Terminator. He doesn't move like one, but it's possible all things considered she might think back to when Kyle told her about the rubber skinned units and think that it might be a lesser unit. She has to see him first though. You have to consider Michael can be standing right next to you at any given time in one of those movies and you'd never know. That's kind of a trademark, the elusive evil. And given the area they're fighting in, that's absolutely one of Michael's advantages.

I could be wrong, but I suspect the environment AP chose was intended to be neutral, rather than giving either character a distinct advantage. Sure, he said it was dark and spooky, but he also said it was a factory, which is a similar environment to those in the climactic scenes of T1 and T2. A typical factory is also a fairly open environment, unlike the more enclosed homes, hospitals or schools Michael usually stalks people in, which will make it difficult for him to get very near an alert Sarah without being spotted. Then we have to consider that Michael isn't that consistent with his use of stealth, and often approaches his prey in plain sight.

But if she does put him down, and no doubt she could with the shotgun, the longer it keeps him there the more apt she is to think he's dead, which again works in his favor for when he inevitably does move away when her guard is let down.

I don't see Sarah dropping her guard quickly, after what she's been through. She's used to seemingly dead or deactivated opponents coming back for one last scare. I wouldn't be surprised if she pulled a Sidney-Prescott-in-Scream-2 and gave Michael an additional headshot after gunning him down, "just in case". Heck, Mickey directly compared Sidney to Linda Hamilton in that scene, an obvious reference to her performance in T2.

And we have to take in account the damage done to the T-1000 maybe being due to its liquid metal nature.  Even Sarah with a handgun in their escape from the mental institution is putting pretty sizable holes in the T-1000, not like the shotgun but still pretty large.

She put holes in the T-1000 with a handgun, but we're talking bullet-sized holes versus baseball-sized holes here. That shotgun clearly inflicted much more damage than a revolver would.

Also Michael takes a few shots from a similar weapon as well as rifles and handguns at the end of Halloween 4 and doesn't take damage like the T-1000. And while I'm not going to QUANtify this and say that he's not getting his limbs blown off because he's not being hit there, but he does take several direct hits, and while such an attack plus a fall about thirty feet down and nearly drowning (not to mention he just got hit by a truck) does put him for a year, he's not splattered everywhere.

It doesn't really matter whether he was splattered everywhere or not. The point is, that amount of gunfire was enough to put him down and out for a year, as you've acknowledged. It shows there are limits to what he can quickly bounce back from. And if that put him down for a year, Sarah unloading on him like she did the T-1000 ought to put him down long enough to qualify as a win as well.

As for the last point, you got lows and highs. Sarah might go toe to toe with him up close, she might get her head twisted off or a finger put through her skull, or even impaled with her own shotgun.

All the things you've mentioned there were things Michael did to nonentities within the Halloween series; clueless characters who were created specifically to die at his hands. Sarah is effectively a final girl, one of the most kickass final girls ever, and as such, I don't see her faring any worse than Laurie or Loomis, who typically survived their encounters with Michael, even when he got up close to them. If anything, she's more liable to get the Busta Rhymes treatment and upend Michael, especially in this day and age of grrl powah. Halloween 2018 was very much in that vein, as Terminator 6 will be by the looks of it.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2018, 03:16:19 PM by The Shuruku Demon »