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Rhino vs Batman

Sick Nick

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2018, 09:45:39 AM »
Rhino will find a way to lose against virtually anyone.

He's a top 10 all-time jobber.

He was on the road to redemption a few years back and was looking like a legit threat again ... but then some cunt in their infinite wisdom decided to throw all of that away. This in spite of the fact he's one of Marvel's top 15-20 strongest supervillains when he's written right.

Pillow Biter

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2018, 11:14:50 AM »
Not sure I want him redeemed. Comics needs a few super-jobbers. Him and Crusher Creel should form a club.

AP

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2018, 11:37:44 AM »
Yeah, I kinda like Rhino as a punching bag.  Some characters work best that way.

Sick Nick

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2018, 11:42:36 AM »
Not sure I want him redeemed. Comics needs a few super-jobbers. Him and Crusher Creel should form a club.

I have an issue when classic characters get swept aside and the only villains that are given any respect are flavour-of-the-month n00bs who won't get remembered five years later. It's not just Creel and Rhino, it's also Abomination, Tiger Shark, the Wrecking Crew, Mr Hyde, Ulik, Orka, pretty much any old-school powerhouses from the 60s or 70s. You could call any of them jobbers.

Instead, we just get endless evil versions of the Hulk and lame rip-offs of DC characters. The only strong guys who consistently get treated fairly from dayes of yore are Juggernaut and Thanos.

The Shuruku Demon

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2018, 11:45:43 AM »
Rhino didn't really start jobbing until the late '80s or early '90s, and he worked fine before that. Better, I'd argue. He's supposed to be the most physically powerful of Spider-Man's main rogues, so it doesn't seem fitting that he should be easy to put down. Easy to outwit, on the other hand? I've no problem with that at all.

Pillow Biter

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #20 on: September 11, 2018, 11:48:14 AM »
Sure. Maybe redeem Rhino. Don't care either way. I'm just saying I don't mind having a few relentless losers in comics. They have their uses.

ProjectCornDog

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #21 on: September 11, 2018, 11:52:12 AM »
I think the problem with Rhino in this situation is the fact he has blatant weaknesses. Against Batman, that is lethal (if he was the lethal type of guy but you get my point).

10/10 but not easy any time.

Sick Nick

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #22 on: September 11, 2018, 12:06:35 PM »
I think the problem with Rhino in this situation is the fact he has blatant weaknesses. Against Batman, that is lethal (if he was the lethal type of guy but you get my point).

10/10 but not easy any time.

Agreed that Bats is perfectly designed to take Rhino down. I have less of an issue with Bats gassing Rhino than I do watching him get one-shot KOed by She-Hulk or beaten down by Luke Cage.

Captain America beat Rhino by taking advantage of his need to breathe and he doesn't have all of Batman's wonderful toys.

Sick Nick

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #23 on: September 11, 2018, 12:10:35 PM »
Sure. Maybe redeem Rhino. Don't care either way. I'm just saying I don't mind having a few relentless losers in comics. They have their uses.

Do they? If they keep losing, there's nothing impressive about the new kid on the block beating them. All that's left is the odd redemption tale or them getting souped up and then getting beaten down yet again. That or they get pitted against weaker and weaker characters, which leads to them losing, which leads to them looking weaker and weaker by proxy.

Mongul has the same problem at DC, he's absolutely sucked since the Crisis. When he was stronger than Superman, it was actually impressive for Supes to take him down, it showed guts and gumption on the Kryptonian's part. Nowadays, beating Mongul is no big deal for the heavy hitters.

Pillow Biter

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #24 on: September 11, 2018, 12:52:17 PM »
Yeah, you can't job out guys you want to be traditional, big bad antagonists. They serve other purposes in other types of stories--rarer types of stories, but ones that are occasionally interesting.

Riv1

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #25 on: September 12, 2018, 05:55:36 AM »
Quote
Mongul has the same problem at DC, he's absolutely sucked since the Crisis. When he was stronger than Superman, it was actually impressive for Supes to take him down, it showed guts and gumption on the Kryptonian's part. Nowadays, beating Mongul is no big deal for the heavy hitters.
Mongul’s Post Crisis return was handled well...

...but you’re right, his current stock is in the crapper.

you’ll never see me coming...

Sick Nick

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #26 on: September 12, 2018, 07:41:26 AM »
Mongul’s Post Crisis return was handled well...

...but you’re right, his current stock is in the crapper.

Even then, though, Supes was weakened and he remarked that he wasn't sure he could beat Mongul if he was at full power ... straight away, that's a big step down from Pre-Crisis Mongul being stated outright to be stronger than Superman. Later, Mongul held back from trying to behead Supes in front of the crowd because he wasn't sure he'd be able to and Draaga, Mongul's prize gladiator, fell to Superman but defeated Mongul himself in combat by tearing off the console on his chest.

Riv1

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #27 on: September 12, 2018, 07:57:12 AM »
I’m not disagreeing at the power loss, just saying his return was handled well.  That was a memorable storyline.
I get you though. I personally have no problem w. some characters being stronger than Supes, as it makes for better...everything, really. An all powerful hero is boring.

you’ll never see me coming...

Red Exodus

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2018, 08:54:03 PM »
I'd argue a more embarrassing defeat was when Spider-Man legitimately man-handled
him in a fit of rage. For being supposedly, Peter's strongest foe, he sure didn't look like
it in that fight.

Sick Nick

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Re: Rhino vs Batman
« Reply #29 on: September 17, 2018, 06:48:16 AM »
I'd argue a more embarrassing defeat was when Spider-Man legitimately man-handled
him in a fit of rage. For being supposedly, Peter's strongest foe, he sure didn't look like
it in that fight.

The time when Spidey was going all evil and emo and nearly killed Electro in his civilian identity? Or there was the time when Spidey managed to catch Rhino's punch in a graveyard.

You get instances like those and then you get instances when Peter can't even *hurt* Rhino and where Rhino says he can barely feel Spidey's blows. Around the time when a second Rhino turned up and battled the original, Rhino was starting to recover some of his earlier prestige but I've seen a couple of truly shitty showings more recently.