Herochat

OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos

Upper_Krust

  • *****
  • 1364
  • +22/-55
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #45 on: August 08, 2018, 01:46:47 PM »
Thanos > Superman
Thanos >= Sundipped Superman (Thanos still wins this fight though)
Kismet-dipped Superman > Thanos

The Captain

  • ***
  • 521
  • +5/-1
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #46 on: August 08, 2018, 02:16:25 PM »
Is Kismet-dipped anything like Barda-dipped? :D


Pillow Biter

  • ******
  • 2111
  • +5/-2
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #47 on: August 08, 2018, 02:19:19 PM »
I don't think Kismet-amped Superman was stronger than Sun Amped Superman. Sun Amped Superman was said by Imperiex to have been powerful enough to beat B-13 with Imperiex's power.

gokenadams

  • *****
  • 1027
  • +9/-18
  • I don't really know or care what an outlier is
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #48 on: August 08, 2018, 02:28:25 PM »
I don't think Kismet-amped Superman was stronger than Sun Amped Superman. Sun Amped Superman was said by Imperiex to have been powerful enough to beat B-13 with Imperiex's power.

so you just gonna ignore what I said eh?

guess concession accepted. especially since no proof was shown anyway

Panthergod

  • ********
  • 7743
  • +45/-82
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #49 on: August 08, 2018, 02:36:03 PM »
Thanos > Superman
Thanos >= Sundipped Superman (Thanos still wins this fight though)
Kismet-dipped Superman > Thanos

Laughable circular logic as usual.

Prove your argument that Thanos does more than get evaporated by SD Superman. All Out Mode alone beats him.

gokenadams

  • *****
  • 1027
  • +9/-18
  • I don't really know or care what an outlier is
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #50 on: August 08, 2018, 02:40:05 PM »

So Panthertard where's proof the probes were weakened that a nuke was able to hurt him? I'll repeat this like i said to pillow bear


""Slowly"
The armaments are working "slowly"

If you want to believe that means the probe was weakened despite the armaments working "slowly" then be my guest. Despite it directly saying they need more power, but yeah, sure, we'll go with it being weakened


Not to mention black lightning himself stated he just needs it be cracked

Meaning it hadn't even been damaged to the point where it wasn't even cracked. So no, the probe was certainly not weakened, especially not to the point where the detonation of a nuclear core can take it out"


Why do you pretend as if you know anything on Superman LMAO?

Pillow Biter

  • ******
  • 2111
  • +5/-2
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #51 on: August 08, 2018, 04:07:01 PM »
I don't have the OWAW comics anymore, even in digital format; and I cannot be arsed to find them, download them, and then open up a photobucket account or whatever to post the relevant scans.

I'm fairly sure of my recollection here, but I'm not infallible. If someone else wants to post the scans, great. If not, c'est la vie.

Finally, most of us here don't like to debate like you do anymore. I never really did, and those that did, have mostly outgrown it. There's no need to treat this as a sport or be so aggressive. If that's how you find your fun, great. See how far it takes you. You can be the next Fangirl, Panthergod, or Abhi. Some of us are too old for that shit. Frankly, if you were more of a generous debater who showed good faith and openness to revising your opinion, I'd be more likely to take the trouble to find the scans you are asking for. But you just don't seem worth it.

gokenadams

  • *****
  • 1027
  • +9/-18
  • I don't really know or care what an outlier is
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #52 on: August 08, 2018, 04:10:29 PM »
I don't have the OWAW comics anymore, even in digital format; and I cannot be arsed to find them, download them, and then open up a photobucket account or whatever to post the relevant scans.

I'm fairly sure of my recollection here, but I'm not infallible. If someone else wants to post the scans, great. If not, c'est la vie.

Finally, most of us here don't like to debate like you do anymore. I never really did, and those that did, have mostly outgrown it. There's no need to treat this as a sport or be so aggressive. If that's how you find your fun, great. See how far it takes you. You can be the next Fangirl, Panthergod, or Abhi. Some of us are too old for that shit. Frankly, if you were more of a generous debater who showed good faith and openness to revising your opinion, I'd be more likely to take the trouble to find the scans you are asking for. But you just don't seem worth it.

sure. what's the issue for the "more details"

and I already addressed the scan you was talking about.


You mentioned the scan claimed about " Luthor's armaments are working."

But you ignored that the scan stated The armaments are working "slowly"

If you want to believe that means the probe was weakened despite the armaments working "slowly" then be my guest. Despite it directly saying they need more power, but yeah, sure, we'll go with it being weakened


Not to mention black lightning himself stated he just needs it be cracked

Meaning it hadn't even been damaged to the point where it wasn't even cracked. So no, the probe was certainly not weakened, especially not to the point where the detonation of a nuclear core can take it out

Pillow Biter

  • ******
  • 2111
  • +5/-2
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #53 on: August 09, 2018, 12:40:57 AM »
The other scans aren't really needed because you have stipulated to whatever they show, it's just your reasoning from there that I now question.

Essentially, battalions of B-13 augmented weaponry wore down the Probe to some degree, though did not crack it. Then Black Lightning channeled the nuclear power core of one of those B-13 augmented tanks to crack and explode the Probe. So all three of these elements were contributing to the win to some degree, but we don't really know the the relative degree of contribution from each factor.

Most importantly, it's typically silly to try to gauge character power by the empirical, objective size of their feats. Superman chills out in a fucking Red Sun one day and gets temporarily KOed by a nuke another. Such are comics. Relative comparisons are far more reliable.

Just look at what combinations of characters single or small groups of Probes laid waste too. That's the more important data.

I will say that the main weaknesses of the Probes is that their shells are very hard, but also brittle relative to their invulnerability. And the joints are a bit vulnerable as well. However, you then have to survive the explosion. In addition, they don't tend to be particularly aggressive, being used to basically being unbeatable.

So for example, Thor with his axe or Terrax or Morg might be able to slice one open, especially if there was someone to help distract the Probe. But the explosion would hurt, maybe even disable them. Thor with Mjolnir might be able to Godblast one safely, as the Probe would probably ignore him and let him build up; but Thor would get creamed by two.

Pillow Biter

  • ******
  • 2111
  • +5/-2
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #54 on: August 09, 2018, 01:27:56 AM »
Actually, there is a way at looking at things that I haven't really explored before: use Doomsday as the metric.

Unleashed Superman could be less powerful or more powerful than Doomsday in OWAW. We can't really know for sure. But what we do know is that Doomsday was able to do the same thing Superman did, so there is no need for Superman to have been more powerful than Doomsday. And despite some mention of Doomsday having a degree of dynamic raw power based on anger and some on-the-fly ability to evolve, Doomsday's overall formidibility is more stable than Superman's was in OWAW.

Naturally, comics often contradict themselves in some ways when it comes to inferring power levels--often even under the same writer. So it's definitely possible I and others have overestimated how much of a power boost Superman received at his peak by just calculating it using the Probes (and perhaps forgetting the Hand Ninja rule': the more you have of something, be it GLs, Kryptonians, or Probes, the less individually powerful they tend to become.

While H&P/Doomsday Wars Doomsday was certainly a beast and more powerful than typical Superman, he did not dwarf the Superman portrayals he went against. So perhaps Superman in OWAW was boosted by less than I thought. Of course, maybe Doomsday was more powerful in OWAW than he was before, as well. Hard to know.

Still, another way of looking at this is Thanos vs. OWAW Doomsday.

Upper_Krust

  • *****
  • 1364
  • +22/-55
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #55 on: August 09, 2018, 12:46:06 PM »
Thanos > Superman
Thanos >= Sundipped Superman (Thanos still wins this fight though)
Kismet-dipped Superman > Thanos

Laughable circular logic as usual.

Is it circular logic or just logic though?

I think there are two key fights here:

1. Thanos vs. Warrior Madness Power Gem Amped Thor - seemed pretty even
2. Thanos vs. Odin - Odin being shown slightly more powerful

From those two fights we see:

Odin > Thanos >> Thor

When we insert Superman into that 'equation' at best he's only slightly better than Thor, giving us:

Odin > Thanos > Superman > Thor

Once we start messing with power-ups, such as sun-dipping we can push Supes further to the left on that list.

Personally that suggests:

Odin = Kismet Dipped Supes > Thanos = Sundipped Supes = WM+PG Thor > Superman = WM OR PG Thor > Thor

Quote
Prove your argument that Thanos does more than get evaporated by SD Superman. All Out Mode alone beats him.

Have you ever changed your mind on any Superman related issue though?  ;D

Your opinion is that Superman > Thanos, but I wonder if you understand why virtually everyone else on this forum doesn't agree with you on this*...?

*and I say that coming from someone who routinely argues against the whole forum so I am not saying you are automatically wrong because of that.

Upper_Krust

  • *****
  • 1364
  • +22/-55
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #56 on: August 09, 2018, 12:47:20 PM »
Is Kismet-dipped anything like Barda-dipped? :D

Lol.  ;D

Upper_Krust

  • *****
  • 1364
  • +22/-55
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #57 on: August 09, 2018, 12:52:41 PM »
I don't think Kismet-amped Superman was stronger than Sun Amped Superman.

...so why bother then?

Quote
Sun Amped Superman was said by Imperiex to have been powerful enough to beat B-13 with Imperiex's power.

I think the devil is in the details here. B-13 may have been 'tapping' the power of Imperiex but he wasn't as powerful AS Imperiex by ANY demonstrable metric.

If a lightbulb powered by a battery instead TAPS INTO the entire national grid it still doesn't emit more power...it only extends its duration.

Pillow Biter

  • ******
  • 2111
  • +5/-2
    • View Profile
Re: OWAW Superman (unleashed) vs Thanos
« Reply #58 on: August 09, 2018, 02:43:30 PM »
That's a possible explanation, but it wasn't my take on things back when I last read OWAW carefully. But we can agree to disagree since it's not really important enough to warrant downloading and reviewing the whole OWAW arc.