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Mangog Punchometer shit

Upper_Krust

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #15 on: January 18, 2018, 05:36:01 PM »
It is magical and charged with cosmic energies.

Mangog does note that Freya is weakened when entering the Destroyer so it was definitely not at full power. Though I am not sure if the strength of the user affects the durability of the armor

From my study of the subject the power of the occupying spirit DOES affect its strength, BUT NOT its durability.

A Mortal Host within gives it strength akin to a Class 100 'brick' like Thor.
An Immortal Host gives it (slightly) superior strength to a Class 100 'brick'.
When Odin 'donned' the armour he was stacking multiple 'power-ups' enabling him to injure Celestials.

Conclusion: The Armour ADDS Class 100 Strength to the existing strength of the host within.

Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2018, 07:09:28 PM »
Jesus, that's an insane showing for Mangog. And some people were claiming it was his weakest portrayal yet based on the number of punches it took to KO War Thor an issue or two ago...

That's because IT WAS his weakest portrayal yet at 19 punches (arguably for a kill).

This whole business simply shows Aaron and Consistency are strange bedfellows.

Only if you are the type of oddball who judges strength by the amount of punches landed.

Mangog casually shattered a Mjolnir stand-in and was flat-out stated to be stronger than ever while utterly owning a Thor substitute more convincingly than he has managed since the Silver Age. You and Abhi were probably the only people that read that issue and decided that he was weaker than ever.


Cheers.

Upper_Krust

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #17 on: January 18, 2018, 08:04:35 PM »
Only if you are the type of oddball who judges strength by the amount of punches landed.

It doesn't matter by what metric you judge it on...its INCONSISTENT.

Mangog punched War Thor's hammer at the start of the fight but didn't break it, then casually breaks it later...ITS INCONSISTENT

Mangog takes 19 attacks* to defeat War Thor then casually defeats the Destroyer armour...ITS INCONSISTENT

*Or an entire issue worth of space

Now yes you can use the 'its comics' defense and handwave it away but this is THE SAME writer within THE SAME Story for goodness sake.

What next...Deathbed Jane punches Mangog's head off his shoulders!!!???

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Mangog casually shattered a Mjolnir stand-in

Which he should have done with his FIRST attack when he smacks the hammer back at War Thor.

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and was flat-out stated to be stronger than ever

While the visual evidence told the exact opposite story.

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while utterly owning a Thor substitute more convincingly than he has managed since the Silver Age.

'Owned' him so badly it took an ENTIRE BOOK to dispose of him, whereas in the past the weakest Mangog (Jurgen's Mangog) has taken a few hits/panels to KO a Thor and the strongest version has taken one hit to KO him.

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You and Abhi were probably the only people that read that issue and decided that he was weaker than ever.

Any other conclusion is pure idiocy.

You don't SHOW Mangog to be MORE powerful by having him take FIVE TIMES as long to dispose of a Thor than the previous WEAKEST incarnation of Mangog.

Commander

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #18 on: January 18, 2018, 10:00:22 PM »
... and so the War of Upper Gree begins!

Strange

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #19 on: January 19, 2018, 01:22:20 AM »
Any story that enrages Krusty over his punch-o-meter being ignored by another writer is a story worth being told in my book

Commander

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #20 on: January 19, 2018, 01:47:13 AM »
Krusty should write a comic using DC or Marvel pop culture icons. Then again if Hulk punches Iron Man it will be a 2 panel comic book with Stark dead on the last panel.

Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #21 on: January 19, 2018, 06:06:42 AM »
Only if you are the type of oddball who judges strength by the amount of punches landed.

It doesn't matter by what metric you judge it on...its INCONSISTENT.

Mangog punched War Thor's hammer at the start of the fight but didn't break it, then casually breaks it later...ITS INCONSISTENT

That's not inconsistent. With sustained effort and two hands anyone could tear apart lots of things that they wouldn't destroy with a single punch.

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Mangog takes 19 attacks* to defeat War Thor then casually defeats the Destroyer armour...ITS INCONSISTENT

It's only inconsistent if you only count on-panel punches as important like you.

Mangog's fight with the Destroyer clearly takes part mostly off-panel. We only see the beginning and the end of the fight.

At any rate, Mangog didn't struggle with War Thor, he completely owned him in a one-sided beatdown.

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While the visual evidence told the exact opposite story.

It didn't though, except to people who think that counting punches is a valid way to measure comic character strength. Mangog has never appeared to be strong enough to tear Mjolnir apart before.

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'Owned' him so badly it took an ENTIRE BOOK to dispose of him, whereas in the past the weakest Mangog (Jurgen's Mangog) has taken a few hits/panels to KO a Thor and the strongest version has taken one hit to KO him.

It took an entire issue of completely one-sided beatdown to dispose of him. It's like arguing that the Hulk vs Abomination from IH #459 was a close fight because it lasted for the entire issue.

Jurgens Mangog was defeated by an attack that this version easily shrugged off.

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Any other conclusion is pure idiocy.

You don't SHOW Mangog to be MORE powerful by having him take FIVE TIMES as long to dispose of a Thor than the previous WEAKEST incarnation of Mangog.

You show Mangog to be more powerful than ever by casually wrecking a Thor stand-in, physically tearing apart a Mjolnir clone and then biting the Destroyer apart.

Aarons Mangog is easily stronger than any version since the Silver Age, and him taking 50 punches to KO War Thor wouldn't have changed that.


Cheers.

Upper_Krust

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #22 on: January 19, 2018, 07:37:17 AM »
Any story that enrages Krusty over his punch-o-meter being ignored by another writer is a story worth being told in my book

Inconsistency is just yet another wave on the ocean of mediocrity destroying the comic book industry...along with the decimating twin tidal waves of decompression and leftist identity politics.

Upper_Krust

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2018, 07:44:34 AM »
Krusty should write a comic using DC or Marvel pop culture icons.


Be careful what you wish for. :)

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Then again if Hulk punches Iron Man it will be a 2 panel comic book with Stark dead on the last panel.

Better Options:
A. Don't have Hulk and Iron Man fight.
B. Concoct some sort of armour wherein Iron Man can go toe-to-toe with the Hulk...but what to call it...got it; the HULK SMASHER ARMOUR. So named because Hulk is always smashing things and now we've flipped the script on him.
C. Have Hulk fight actual villains* not heroes
D. Have Hulk fight villains closer to his power level

*Like RiRi Williams

Upper_Krust

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #24 on: January 19, 2018, 08:17:19 AM »
That's not inconsistent.


I disagree, its textbook inconsistency.

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With sustained effort and two hands anyone could tear apart lots of things that they wouldn't destroy with a single punch.

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Mangog takes 19 attacks* to defeat War Thor then casually defeats the Destroyer armour...ITS INCONSISTENT

It's only inconsistent if you only count on-panel punches as important like you.

Its inconsistent by ANY metric of measurement. Punches, panels, page time, screen time, story time, logic etc.

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Mangog's fight with the Destroyer clearly takes part mostly off-panel.

Its up there in my top ten off-panel fights of all time.  ::)

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We only see the beginning and the end of the fight.

By what metric does the Destroyer look tougher than War Thor?

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At any rate, Mangog didn't struggle with War Thor, he completely owned him in a one-sided beatdown.

Is War Thor tougher than the Destroyer armour? If not, why was he depicted as such?

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While the visual evidence told the exact opposite story.

It didn't though, except to people who think that counting punches is a valid way to measure comic character strength.

Lets transpose your babbling argument into a movie scene - for simple observation purposes.

Batman vs. Superman lets say.

Doomsday spends 20 minutes punching Batman into a bloodied pulp but then later spends 1 minute of screen time to wreck Superman.

Which character in the above scenario appears tougher? Batman or Superman.

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Mangog has never appeared to be strong enough to tear Mjolnir apart before.

I agree. We are simply debating the inconsistency of Aaron's writing of Mangog.

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'Owned' him so badly it took an ENTIRE BOOK to dispose of him, whereas in the past the weakest Mangog (Jurgen's Mangog) has taken a few hits/panels to KO a Thor and the strongest version has taken one hit to KO him.

It took an entire issue of completely one-sided beatdown to dispose of him. It's like arguing that the Hulk vs Abomination from IH #459 was a close fight because it lasted for the entire issue.

No it isn't, unless the SAME character within the SAME story also went on to easily dismantle an opponent many magnitudes more powerful/durable with FAR LESS effort.

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Jurgens Mangog was defeated by an attack that this version easily shrugged off.

Yes but Jurgen's Mangog was CONSISTENT within that story.

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Any other conclusion is pure idiocy.

You don't SHOW Mangog to be MORE powerful by having him take FIVE TIMES as long to dispose of a Thor than the previous WEAKEST incarnation of Mangog.

You show Mangog to be more powerful than ever by casually wrecking a Thor stand-in,

19 attacks is not a casual wrecking, its akin to the same number of attacks Doomsday takes to kill Superman in the Death of Superman storyline.

Casually wrecking someone is accomplished in a few hits or less.

Like when Hulk casually wrecks various foes in World War Hulk (Thing, Ares)...then the fights get a bit tougher (Hulkbuster Armour, Zom Strange) then finally the big showdown* with Sentry

*Lasting an issue...as did the War Thor 'fight'.   :P

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physically tearing apart a Mjolnir clone and then biting the Destroyer apart.

I agree with these last two, but they sit at odds with the other nonsense.

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Aarons Mangog is easily stronger than any version since the Silver Age, and him taking 50 punches to KO War Thor wouldn't have changed that.

Aaron's Mangog has two good feats: destroying Ult. Mjolnir and the Destroyer armour. He also has two crap ones in the War Thor beatdown taking an eternity and the Heimdall wound.

-K-M-

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2018, 08:59:22 AM »
Keep in mind the soul powering the destroyer was weakened. Mangog even says that

Upper_Krust

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #26 on: January 19, 2018, 09:22:07 AM »
Keep in mind the soul powering the destroyer was weakened. Mangog even says that

1. That's NEVER been a factor in the Destroyer's durability.
2. Frigga was still vastly more powerful than a mortal host.
3. If a weakened Frigga powering the armour was a bad idea (say rather than Cul or Odin themselves) then why did no one point that particular idiocy out? Was it simply to reinforce Aaron's idea that all women are heroic martyrs?

Panthergod

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Re: Mangog Punchometer shit
« Reply #27 on: January 19, 2018, 11:21:18 AM »
Heh, Odin cowers in the Throne room and sends his woman to fight for him.  What a bitch.

Rage.Of.Olympus

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #28 on: January 19, 2018, 11:28:14 AM »
Jesus, that's an insane showing for Mangog. And some people were claiming it was his weakest portrayal yet based on the number of punches it took to KO War Thor an issue or two ago...


Cheers.
This Mangog is easier to hurt than before but his strength showings are better than ever.

Why?

He specifically shrugged off a tactic that was used to beat him previously...
The way Heimdall stabbed him.

Hemidall's big ass magic sword that was enchanted by Odin, can wield cosmic energies, control the BiFrost and has clashed with Mjolnir unscathed?

Mangog isn't slowed down and shatters it easily. Aaron even has Heimdall specifically mention Hofund by name, which hasn't been done in decades.

You're an idiot.

The Shuruku Demon

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Re: Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« Reply #29 on: January 19, 2018, 12:37:37 PM »
Have we seen comparable attempts to cut Mangog in the past that fail to do so?

Fandral explicitly couldn't cut Mangog in the first story arc he appeared in.




There are a couple of later story arcs where Mangog's skin was pierced by Asgardian blades (by Fandral in the '70s, and by Gruenhilda a few years ago), although Mangog no-sold these strikes as if they were less than bee stings.