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Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?

Panthergod

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #180 on: February 02, 2018, 02:28:46 PM »
The FBI colluded with the DNC to depose Trump with the fake Russia investigation via the Steele memo.

Trump at this point will certainly win reelection.

Thank the DNC for that.
What is the "fake Russia Investigation"?
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/house-intel-memo-released-what-it-says/article/2647937
Do you know what a Congressional memo is?

Do you know what contempt of court is?
Yes.

I'll accept your attempt to change the conversation as a wholehearted agreement and concession that you do not, in fact, know what a Congressional memo is.

So more excuses to support dnc+fbi+establishment media deliberately lying to the public and the courts to overturn an election. That's who you are. Own it.

XerxesTWD

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #181 on: February 02, 2018, 02:31:35 PM »
The FBI colluded with the DNC to depose Trump with the fake Russia investigation via the Steele memo.

Trump at this point will certainly win reelection.

Thank the DNC for that.
What is the "fake Russia Investigation"?
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/house-intel-memo-released-what-it-says/article/2647937
Do you know what a Congressional memo is?

Do you know what contempt of court is?
Yes.

I'll accept your attempt to change the conversation as a wholehearted agreement and concession that you do not, in fact, know what a Congressional memo is.

So more excuses to support dnc+fbi+establishment media deliberately lying to the public and the courts to overturn an election. That's who you are. Own it.
Now you're just spamming nonsense based on a memo filled with holes and objectively laughable leaps in logic.

Stop humiliating yourself.

Panthergod

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #182 on: February 02, 2018, 02:37:27 PM »
The FBI colluded with the DNC to depose Trump with the fake Russia investigation via the Steele memo.

Trump at this point will certainly win reelection.

Thank the DNC for that.
What is the "fake Russia Investigation"?
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/house-intel-memo-released-what-it-says/article/2647937
Do you know what a Congressional memo is?

Do you know what contempt of court is?
Yes.

I'll accept your attempt to change the conversation as a wholehearted agreement and concession that you do not, in fact, know what a Congressional memo is.

So more excuses to support dnc+fbi+establishment media deliberately lying to the public and the courts to overturn an election. That's who you are. Own it.
Now you're just spamming nonsense based on a memo filled with holes and objectively laughable leaps in logic.

Stop humiliating yourself.

So the Steele memo is true, then. That's your argument. Don't even pretend to run away from that

XerxesTWD

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #183 on: February 02, 2018, 02:44:23 PM »
The FBI colluded with the DNC to depose Trump with the fake Russia investigation via the Steele memo.

Trump at this point will certainly win reelection.

Thank the DNC for that.
What is the "fake Russia Investigation"?
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/house-intel-memo-released-what-it-says/article/2647937
Do you know what a Congressional memo is?

Do you know what contempt of court is?
Yes.

I'll accept your attempt to change the conversation as a wholehearted agreement and concession that you do not, in fact, know what a Congressional memo is.

So more excuses to support dnc+fbi+establishment media deliberately lying to the public and the courts to overturn an election. That's who you are. Own it.
Now you're just spamming nonsense based on a memo filled with holes and objectively laughable leaps in logic.

Stop humiliating yourself.

So the Steele memo is true, then. That's your argument. Don't even pretend to run away from that
First: Steele wrote a dossier. Not a memo. They're entirely different types of aggregated information. Dossiers are longer and much more in depth.

Second: YOU are the one asserting the memo is 100% false.

Third: the Nunes memo specifically asserts Steele had proved reliable in the past, they just don't think what he provided this time was true. Why? Because he doesn't like the individual the dossier was about(Donald Trump). This is a critically stupid foundation to build on when you try and discredit something from an individual you are actively admitting is reliable IN THE SAME DOCUMENT. Writing a dossier requires information. It does not require objectivity.

MTL76

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #184 on: February 02, 2018, 04:04:48 PM »
Isn’t the problem with Steele’s dossier that:

-it has not been corroborated by any other sources?
-it was paid for by the DNC?
-it was used as the justification to obtain the warrant to spy on a member of Trump’s campaign?
-the court issuing the warrant was not made aware that the dossier was the only reason the warrant was being sought?

These aren’t rhetorical questions, I’m legitimately asking. It seems like each media outlet has a diffferent spin on things.

Trump clearly has made poor choices in picking people to work for him, and there may be legitimate reasons why they were being watched. But the FBI withholding the source of their suspicions from the court shows that maybe they didn’t think they’d get their warrant if they were more forthcoming. It may have been sheer laziness on their part. There’s no evidence someone like Obama or Clinton ordered them to do anything.


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therock

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #185 on: February 02, 2018, 04:16:16 PM »
apprent the steele dossier wasnt the only thing that got them a warrant

it just the gop memo written by apparently the white house may of left that out

remember these trump picks saying this

the issue is this may start a prescident of leaking these memos without going through the normal process. and if this going to be the prescident stepping forwards

because dems will want to leak theres. and that back and fourth will be bad.

XerxesTWD

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #186 on: February 02, 2018, 04:44:05 PM »
Isn’t the problem with Steele’s dossier that:

-it has not been corroborated by any other sources?
The reason the dossier was taken seriously in the first place was because it corroborated intelligence that would most likely not have been shared with Steele. Somebody with a reputation of reliability comes up to you and says starts telling you shit you already had some supporting evidence for, you are likely to listen. Like virtually every dossier around, not all of it is accurate. Some extrapolations are made when dossiers are created because they are often built off interviews, recordings you only have one side of, out of context conversations, photographs, rumors, etc.

When Donald Trump's own children, the ones he claims are running his entire "multi-billion-dollar" corporate empire right now, repeatedly assert their family and holdings have specific financial and personal ties to Russia over the course of several years, you have to consider the following about their connections to Russia:
Were they lying then to try and impress everyone? Possibly.
Were they telling the truth then to try and impress everyone? Probably.

Are they lying now about connections to Russia? Probably.
Are they telling the truth now about connections to Russia? Possibly.


-it was paid for by the DNC?
FusionGPS was contracted in February 2015 by a Republican website called Washington Free Beacon, financed by a GOP megadonor/superdonor Paul Singer. After Trump wound up beating the establishment candidates, they were going to drop the research. In April 2016, the DNC and Clinton campaign continued funding the research.

Unethical, certainly. Does that inherently make any of it untrue? I think doubting is fair, but asserting it's untrue simply because the DNC kept the ball rolling is patently ridiculous. Dossiers are aggregated information. You are going to aggregate what is being sought.

SWOT (Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities, Threats), personal connections, financial connections, etc. are all fair game when you are building a dossier. There is bias in every dossier ever written. Just because the author of this one disliked Trump it's automatically false? While in the same memo they're saying Steele has a proven history of reliable information?

One of Steele's informants, a high-rank Russian general, was killed. It is speculated (and asserted specifically to Congress by FusionGPS) he was killed for contributing to the dossier.

Oddly, the same people jumping on board with every conspiracy theory around are claiming THIS death is a coincidence, but every other death is somehow the doings of a Globalist mastermind somewhere.


-it was used as the justification to obtain the warrant to spy on a member of Trump’s campaign?
It was used as additional justification to spy on a guy they were already watching for a couple years.


-the court issuing the warrant was not made aware that the dossier was the only reason the warrant was being sought?
He was already being watched. The dossier was used as additional support for the spying.



These aren’t rhetorical questions, I’m legitimately asking. It seems like each media outlet has a diffferent spin on things.
I think they're fair questions and agree we're getting all kinds of stories. Anybody on any side pretending this is an all-or-nothing situation is just engaging in partisan nonsense. Not everything Trump (or his associates/kids) has done was out of malice, stupidity, etc.


Trump clearly has made poor choices in picking people to work for him, and there may be legitimate reasons why they were being watched. But the FBI withholding the source of their suspicions from the court shows that maybe they didn’t think they’d get their warrant if they were more forthcoming. It may have been sheer laziness on their part. There’s no evidence someone like Obama or Clinton ordered them to do anything.
The Nunes memo only includes some information. They cherrypicked a lot of documents. That's what the Democrat memo is/was asserting. It says Nunes' memo looked for specific info to fit an agenda and excluded the rest of the intelligence other members of the SAME INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE saw to build his case against the Russia investigation.

NeoGreenLantern

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #187 on: February 02, 2018, 04:58:32 PM »
The Nune's Memo is basically hearing just the defense attorney and never getting to hear the  prosecutor or seeing the evidence yourself.

NeoGreenLantern

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #188 on: February 02, 2018, 11:48:34 PM »
Apparently he didn't read the FISA applications himself either.


XerxesTWD

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #190 on: February 05, 2018, 05:29:27 PM »
People like to make fun of Jeb and "Please clap."

Today at one of his rallies, Trump literally said if you don't clap for him it should be treason.

80sBaby

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #191 on: February 05, 2018, 05:54:17 PM »
People like to make fun of Jeb and "Please clap."

Today at one of his rallies, Trump literally said if you don't clap for him it should be treason.

Yes, yes he did.

MTL76

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #192 on: February 05, 2018, 06:04:08 PM »
Both parties have been accusing each other of treason or anti-Americanism to some level or another over the past year, minimum. This is the new normal.


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80sBaby

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #193 on: February 05, 2018, 06:05:48 PM »
Both parties have been accusing each other of treason to some level or another over the past year, minimum. This is the new normal.

There's a distinct difference between claiming that a politician committed actual treasonous acts and trying to make not clapping into an actual treasonous act.

Don't "same thing, both sides" this.

XerxesTWD

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Re: Will Trump go down as the worst president ever?
« Reply #194 on: February 05, 2018, 06:07:39 PM »
Both parties have been accusing each other of treason or anti-Americanism to some level or another over the past year, minimum. This is the new normal.
That's not even CLOSE to accurate.