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Song of Ice and Fire theories that you love, hate, or just want to see*spoilers*

Von Doom

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The GoT thread got me thinking about some of the fan theories again, and I've come to realize that one that seems very likely to come true is one that I really would rather not, namely Tyrion is a Targaryen. In fact, a lot of ASOIAF fan theories are just "so-and-so is actually from this other family" and those aren't super interesting. Maybe it could be interesting if Varys really was a Blackfyre.

I don't even know if anyone here really gets into the various theories about the series, but if so, are there any theories out there that really resonate with you and you want to either see proven? Are there any that you dislike and would be annoyed if they turned out to be correct? Are there any that are not remotely likely but are still interesting enough to stick out?

As I mentioned, I would rather not see Tyrion turn out to be Aeris's kid, because I think it kind of ruins the dynamic between Tyrion and Tywin. I like how similar the two are in certain ways, and I think it makes for a better bit of drama if Tywin mistreats Tyrion because he sees so much of himself in Tyrion's twisted, impish form. Make him Aeris's rape baby and suddenly Tywin is just mad that he's raising his enemy's son.

One I do like that gets quite a bit of flack is the Jojen paste idea - Jojen and sacrificed and some of his remains or maybe just blood was in the weirwood paste that Bran eats to awaken his powers.

I don't want it to be true simply because it's gruesome. Rather it would seem like a cop-out if suddenly an extremely powerful act of magic(arguably the most powerful magic in the series) didn't require the blood sacrifice that most everything else does. The last chapter with Jojen sets up his death so well too - the references to past sacrifices, the descriptive word choices, and Jojen's sour ass mood.

The main point detractors make is that Jojen has always said he'd die at home. That means nothing. He could easily lie to Meera when they're out and about so that she doesn't worry about her scrawny little brother while they're in the midst of blood and death. The second point that is brought up is that it's gross and stupid and Martin wouldn't do that kind of thing. I have to wonder what series of books those people are reading.

As for a theory that is kind of out there and likely will have zero bearing on anything at all is that Patchface is connected to the Drowned God. Patchface was seemingly resurrected and has prophetic moments which could point to some kind of supernatural influence. The Drowned God simply makes sense because of the manner of his apparent death. I get that there are enough resurrections, and I don't think it adds much to the main story, but it's still kind of cool.

Bonus insane theory: Bran = all the gods

Mightily Oats

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Tywin never knowing for sure that Tyrion is his blood son or not is the source of the dynamic, IMO.

David Gemmell used almost the exact same dynamic in his book Ravenheart, book 3 of 4 in the Rigante series, and that book is what tips me off that the odds are really good it could go either way with Tyrion

MTL76

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I agree that it would be a bad idea for it to be confirmed that Tyrion is someone else's son. I don't mind if it's left as an unanswered question, as this adds another layer to their tortured relationship. But I like to think that Tyrion is Tywin's son, even if the characters are never sure of it, as it shows Tywin's most fatal flaw. If only he could have looked past Tyrion's size, he would have recognized Tyrion as his true heir and a worthy head of House Lannister.


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Gree

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Ice dragon

Von Doom

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Leaving Tyrion's parentage unanswered would be just fine by me.

As for the ice dragon, is that something you want to see? I admit that I kind of do too, but I'm unsure where it would come in. There's the idea that there's one within the Wall, and the horn that is supposed to bring down the Wall is just another dragon horn that will wake it up. One of Daenerys' dragons could die and be raised as an dragon wight as well. Then there's the weird connection between Martin's children's story about an ice dragon becoming a pool of water that is always cold and the pool within the weirwood grove at Winterfell with an always-cold pond. I honestly think that was just a fun little reference for any of Martin's readers who actually read his earlier work.

Mightily Oats

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Leaving Tyrion's parentage unanswered would be just fine by me.
But here's the important part

Tywin is dead

Their dynamic changes not one iota if now there is a revelation.

You as a reader have a different perspective, but the important part is that Tywin never knew in his lifetime

Not you
Quote
As for the ice dragon, is that something you want to see? I admit that I kind of do too, but I'm unsure where it would come in. There's the idea that there's one within the Wall, and the horn that is supposed to bring down the Wall is just another dragon horn that will wake it up. One of Daenerys' dragons could die and be raised as an dragon wight as well. Then there's the weird connection between Martin's children's story about an ice dragon becoming a pool of water that is always cold and the pool within the weirwood grove at Winterfell with an always-cold pond. I honestly think that was just a fun little reference for any of Martin's readers who actually read his earlier work.
Martin also has a reference to a god that only existed in one of his 1000 world or whatever he called his sci fi sort of continuity stories

He references a lot of things, including himself, and I agree that it's more than likely just a wink and a nod for himself and fans

MTL76

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But here's the important part

Tywin is dead

Their dynamic changes not one iota if now there is a revelation.

You as a reader have a different perspective, but the important part is that Tywin never knew in his lifetime

Not you

But Tyrion is alive. The knowledge that his father never loved him or appreciated his talents is a major part of his character, and that doesn't necessarily go away with Tywin's death. Finding out that Tywin wasn't his real father removes this.

It also changes his relationship to Jaime and Cersei.


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LiquidSailor

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Future Bran warged into current Bran to stop judgement day.

DIGUSTING

Mightily Oats

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But here's the important part

Tywin is dead

Their dynamic changes not one iota if now there is a revelation.

You as a reader have a different perspective, but the important part is that Tywin never knew in his lifetime

Not you

But Tyrion is alive. The knowledge that his father never loved him or appreciated his talents is a major part of his character, and that doesn't necessarily go away with Tywin's death. Finding out that Tywin wasn't his real father removes this.
Not really.

It someone raises you as their son, you're their son

This is the dark side of adoption
Quote

It also changes his relationship to Jaime and Cersei.
He'd still be their half brother, so again, not really

And again, raised as = is

You think Jon is gonna stop thinking of Bran as his brother/half even when he finds out they're actually cousins, or stop thinking of Ned as his father even though it's Rhaegar?

Come now

MTL76

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I think if Tyrion found out he had a different birth father, it would definitely change his self-esteem issues and the way he views himself. I'm not denigrating the bond between adoptive parents and their children, but Tywin treated Tyrion like shit. Being rejected by the one person who should have loved him unconditionally sucks, and Tyrion was/is starved for a parental figure. It would be different if Tywin had raised Tyrion with love and respect.

This is basically the dream of every kid who feels unloved by their parents. "If only I was adopted, and my real parents are out there. I bet they're so cool..."

Though killing Tywin seems to have cured Tyrion of his self-destructive impulses just as much.

But you're right, I was off-base on the comment about his relationship with his siblings.



« Last Edit: August 05, 2017, 04:16:29 PM by MTL76 »


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Mightily Oats

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Finding out your dad was the insane old man that your brother killed isn't gonna really be the upside to Tywin