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Author Topic: Lazy Americans!  (Read 312 times)

Dlbiininja

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Lazy Americans!
« on: April 01, 2017, 07:21:55 AM »

So, with illegals trying to avoid being captured.  And jobs freeing up.  Why aren't more Americans going after these jobs? Are they just too good for the work?  Or just entitled lazy shits?  This would be an excellent side gig for stay at home moms when their childrens are in the daycare. 

 Check out the story.  This was discussed on the Tom leykis show today.

http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-farms-immigration/

ProjectCornDog

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2017, 12:34:02 PM »

This is why I support worker visa programs over pure amnesty. Once they become citizens and are entitled to minimum wage, why would they do these jobs either?
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MTL76

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2017, 01:49:35 PM »

This is why I support worker visa programs over pure amnesty. Once they become citizens and are entitled to minimum wage, why would they do these jobs either?

This is a question that I've asked over and over, but no one can seem to answer for me. The same people who are pushing for a $15 minimum wage are the same people who say we need immigrants to do the jobs that Americans are too lazy to do and that without cheap immigrant labor our economy would tank, and they're ALSO they same people who say that no immigrant should be illegal, which would mean that all immigrants would be... making the minimum wage and no longer be cheap labor.
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ProjectCornDog

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2017, 02:15:14 PM »

This is why I support worker visa programs over pure amnesty. Once they become citizens and are entitled to minimum wage, why would they do these jobs either?

This is a question that I've asked over and over, but no one can seem to answer for me. The same people who are pushing for a $15 minimum wage are the same people who say we need immigrants to do the jobs that Americans are too lazy to do and that without cheap immigrant labor our economy would tank, and they're ALSO they same people who say that no immigrant should be illegal, which would mean that all immigrants would be... making the minimum wage and no longer be cheap labor.

Hard to answer a question there is no right answer to.
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NeoGreenLantern

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #4 on: April 01, 2017, 02:16:09 PM »

Here is how I'd set up both minimum wage and a work/amnesty system.

I'd pump minimum wage up to $10 to $15 dependent on the cost of living of the area.
I'd put in a stipulation were anyone under the age of 18 can be paid as little as the current minimum wage if they are living at home. For anyone minor who can prove they are the primary source of income for their family they can get government assistance to bring them up to their local minimum wage.
For illegal workers and the people who hire them I'd set up an amnesty program where the business can sponsor the illegal worker giving both sides amnesty. They can continue to pay their worker the equivalent pay with the stipulation they have to raise their pay annually until they reach their local minimum wage. During this time the worker cannot quit unless they have another job lined up. They would also have to go through the necessary citizenship requirements and pass their citizenship test before the amnesty period is over.
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MTL76

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2017, 02:40:43 PM »

These types of central planning ideas never seem to end well.
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therock

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #6 on: April 01, 2017, 03:14:55 PM »

This is why I support worker visa programs over pure amnesty. Once they become citizens and are entitled to minimum wage, why would they do these jobs either?

This is a question that I've asked over and over, but no one can seem to answer for me. The same people who are pushing for a $15 minimum wage are the same people who say we need immigrants to do the jobs that Americans are too lazy to do and that without cheap immigrant labor our economy would tank, and they're ALSO they same people who say that no immigrant should be illegal, which would mean that all immigrants would be... making the minimum wage and no longer be cheap labor.

LEts be honest a lot of people dont want to do those Jobs even if it was at minum wage which some of them not. Its back breaking work. They can get away with paying them cheap without benifits because where the fuck they going to go. Even some of the poorest Americans got better options then that. They least want some worker protection. Which where you get the contradiction. Because deep down they know the argument "Hey we NEED the slave like labor" kind of fucked up. Maybe some of that argument is them going "shit if I can tug on your heart string by the pure emphany argument let me make the finniacial arugment"

I go for the more hey if you been here since you were 2...and your 20 find your beat the system your in. I am not going to deport some 15 year old to a country he never been. Or worst let someone in his 20 who working and adding to the system. But other then that more open to reather to deport you or not. But only really put a priority on the dangerous ones but sitll deport. What obama basicly did to earn both the "deporter in cheif label" and the  "OH GAWD..he going to cause mexicans to rape our women label".

issue is that either make me a snowflake pussy in some circles or a damm racist in others.



But that goes for the Aniti side. They rarely go after the people hiring them. Because those people are donors to politicians. And they make thier money for them. But they dont want to make their workers citezens or they will demand more money..and fuck mexicans. Also it good to blame people promblem on immigrant and not jobs being ship over seas or mechanical replacing our Jobs because its an easier targett. You dont have to deal with the real issue of certain Jobs not coming back.  I mean if where a nation of laws, start thowoing some of the people hiring them in Jail.

so both sides dont reallt want to solve the issue. dont think more boarders is racist. But also dont think a pathway to citezenship mean will become NEW new mexico or MEXICO the 3rd

You can change both you cant do it suddenly. Since people got to adjust. But it no sunstable to keep going to same route either..once cost of living keep going up. Since people need money to buy shit in order for the enconmy. I one that says not every place needs to be 15. Should be raise sure but depends on the area

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Panthergod

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #7 on: April 01, 2017, 09:55:07 PM »

people who support illegals being used for cheao labor support de facto wage slavery.
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ProjectCornDog

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #8 on: April 01, 2017, 10:53:46 PM »

I don't agree with you rock that former illegals would continue to do that type of work for minimum wage, it's described as back breaking for a reason.

Panther, globalization relies on low wage labor, don't kid yourself.
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therock

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #9 on: April 01, 2017, 11:04:56 PM »

I don't agree with you rock that former illegals would continue to do that type of work for minimum wage, it's described as back breaking for a reason.

Panther, globalization relies on low wage labor, don't kid yourself.

No Im saying the opposit...that they wont.

That why the right side dont want to make them legal..let they not going after the people who hire them for thier companies

Because


This is why I support worker visa programs over pure amnesty. Once they become citizens and are entitled to minimum wage, why would they do these jobs either?

This is a question that I've asked over and over, but no one can seem to answer for me. The same people who are pushing for a $15 minimum wage are the same people who say we need immigrants to do the jobs that Americans are too lazy to do and that without cheap immigrant labor our economy would tank, and they're ALSO they same people who say that no immigrant should be illegal, which would mean that all immigrants would be... making the minimum wage and no longer be cheap labor.

LEts be honest a lot of people dont want to do those Jobs even if it was at minum wage which some of them not. Its back breaking work. They can get away with paying them cheap without benifits because where the fuck they going to go. Even some of the poorest Americans got better options then that. They least want some worker protection. Which where you get the contradiction. Because deep down they know the argument "Hey we NEED the slave like labor" kind of fucked up. Maybe some of that argument is them going "shit if I can tug on your heart string by the pure emphany argument let me make the finniacial arugment"

I go for the more hey if you been here since you were 2...and your 20 find your beat the system your in. I am not going to deport some 15 year old to a country he never been. Or worst let someone in his 20 who working and adding to the system. But other then that more open to reather to deport you or not. But only really put a priority on the dangerous ones but sitll deport. What obama basicly did to earn both the "deporter in cheif label" and the  "OH GAWD..he going to cause mexicans to rape our women label".

issue is that either make me a snowflake pussy in some circles or a damm racist in others.



But that goes for the Aniti side. They rarely go after the people hiring them. Because those people are donors to politicians. And they make thier money for them. But they dont want to make their workers citezens or they will demand more money..and fuck mexicans. Also it good to blame people promblem on immigrant and not jobs being ship over seas or mechanical replacing our Jobs because its an easier targett. You dont have to deal with the real issue of certain Jobs not coming back.  I mean if where a nation of laws, start thowoing some of the people hiring them in Jail.

so both sides dont reallt want to solve the issue. dont think more boarders is racist. But also dont think a pathway to citezenship mean will become NEW new mexico or MEXICO the 3rd

You can change both you cant do it suddenly. Since people got to adjust. But it no sunstable to keep going to same route either..once cost of living keep going up. Since people need money to buy shit in order for the enconmy. I one that says not every place needs to be 15. Should be raise sure but depends on the area


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Imperial

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #10 on: April 01, 2017, 11:08:26 PM »

Quote
Carrying a fat stack of business cards for his company, Silverado Farming, Solorio approached one prospect, a man with only his bottom set of teeth. He told Solorio that farm work in Stockton pays $11 to $12 an hour. Solorio countered: “Look, we are paying $14.50 now, but we are going up to $16.” The man nodded skeptically.

I've done hard physical work for less.

Anyway they should legalize all current illegals. Let them pay into the system more. But then regulate new arrivals afterward from everywhere. You can't put the genie back in the bottle for those already here though. No more than you can perform a successful drug or gun war.
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Dlbiininja

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #11 on: April 02, 2017, 02:16:44 AM »

Here's a few other things from the article to consider.

Today, farmworkers in the state earn about $30,000 a year if they work full time — about half the overall average pay in California. Most work fewer hours.

Some farmers are even giving laborers benefits normally reserved for white-collar professionals, like 401(k) plans, health insurance, subsidized housing and profit-sharing bonuses. Full-timers at Silverado Farming, for example, get most of those sweeteners, plus 10 paid vacation days, eight paid holidays, and can earn their hourly rate to take English classes.
ADVERTISEMENT

But the raises and new perks have not tempted native-born Americans to leave their day jobs for the fields. Nine in 10 agriculture workers in California are still foreign born, and more than half are undocumented, according to a federal survey.



   Napa farm workers are state’s highest paid
   
   Areas like Napa County, where high-value wine grapes are grown, are luring workers from lower-paying areas like San Joaquin County
That’s the reason that Napa County pays its farmworkers $41,940 a year, the highest in California, our analysis of federal data shows.

Check out the Map in the article.  They can actually do pretty well.

g-train

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2017, 02:32:30 AM »

Here's a few other things from the article to consider.

Today, farmworkers in the state earn about $30,000 a year if they work full time — about half the overall average pay in California. Most work fewer hours.

Some farmers are even giving laborers benefits normally reserved for white-collar professionals, like 401(k) plans, health insurance, subsidized housing and profit-sharing bonuses. Full-timers at Silverado Farming, for example, get most of those sweeteners, plus 10 paid vacation days, eight paid holidays, and can earn their hourly rate to take English classes.
ADVERTISEMENT

But the raises and new perks have not tempted native-born Americans to leave their day jobs for the fields. Nine in 10 agriculture workers in California are still foreign born, and more than half are undocumented, according to a federal survey.



   Napa farm workers are state’s highest paid
   
   Areas like Napa County, where high-value wine grapes are grown, are luring workers from lower-paying areas like San Joaquin County
That’s the reason that Napa County pays its farmworkers $41,940 a year, the highest in California, our analysis of federal data shows.

Check out the Map in the article.  They can actually do pretty well.

The average pay in California is $60,000 grand a year?

Holy shit am I in the wrong state.
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MTL76

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2017, 02:43:56 AM »

If you legalize every illegal immigrant in the USA, new ones will come to replace their spot as lowest on the economic totem pole. In fact, a general amnesty will be a strong incentive for others to enter the country illegally, hoping that the amnesty will be repeated, or that immigration lawyers will point out the unfairness of deporting someone who came a couple of days after the amnesty. Any amnesty needs to be tied to border control - strict, utterly draconian border control. But most Americans won't have the stomach for that.
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therock

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Re: Lazy Americans!
« Reply #14 on: April 02, 2017, 03:03:36 AM »

We do got pretty strict boarder control since net immigration been low for a bit

Question is how much boarder resources do we want spent with chasing after general law abiding ones that been here for decades

As long as there people who can offer to give them jobs and the employees of them pay ZERO consequences it will always be a part of America
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