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Messages - Liam Gallaghers Unibrow

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ICT / Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« on: September 19, 2018, 03:06:49 PM »
We'll see how well that holds out when Hulk fights She Hulk with help from Thor, Hulkbuster Iron Man, Captain Marvel, Ghost Rider, Black Panther and Cap in two weeks time...


ICT / Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« on: September 10, 2018, 04:48:18 PM »
Apologies for the delayed response, had a hectic few days.

No need to apologise, I didn't take anything personally and apologise if I came across overly defensive. There's enough weirdness in the issue that there's a lot open to interpretation so I don't have any problems respectfully agreeing to disagree on a few things, and I think we've reached the point where continuing to go through blow-by-blow isn't overly productive so I won't go through each point in the post.

Having re-read the issue a few times now, my interpretation of the fight is essentially that it breaks down into four phases.

1) Hulk vs Brian Banner-controlled Sasquatch; Hulk unaware it is Brian
This part is fairly self-explanatory. Hulk seems to have the advantage initially at least.

2) Hulk vs Brian Banner-controlled Sasquatch; Hulk aware it is Brian
Again fairly self-explanatory. Hulk collapses mentally upon learning that he's facing his old man, his will to resist almost disappears and he is crawling away begging Brian to leave him alone. He's basically a scared child at this point and Brian is torturing him.

3) Hulk gets mad, smashes Brian
Hulk overcomes his fear and gets angry - very angry - starting with kicking Sasquatch away as he is clawing his guts. For a couple of pages Hulk goes full spaz, to the point of reverting to a more savage speech pattern (I think it's non-sensical to suggest that the Hulk would be weaker because he is reverting to the Savage Hulk... he's the Hulk, and he's getting madder, so there's every reason to think he's getting stronger at this point). Hulk again gains a clear advantage here, and hits Sasquatch hard enough to knock some lucidity into Brian, who starts talking like he has lost the will to fight. This is the point that Brian starts talking about there being something worse responsible for his return, something that "wears our souls like masks on a stage", and he even asks Hulk to help him. Hulk demands answers as to what this being is, at which point...

4) Hulk vs The One Below All
...whatever it is that has Brian Banner scared assumes direct control over Sasquatch. The immediate result is the punch-catch and another dramatic shift in the momentum of the fight (Hulk getting his eyes gouged out and Sasquatch gaining a clear advantage). IMHO it is no longer Brian talking from the punch catch onwards, it's The One Below All. I think this is the best explanation for the sudden shift in speech after Brian's plea for help, and the corresponding turn in the way the fight is going.

So essentially the way I see it is that Hulk - once he gets seriously pissed - is on the verge of winning against Brian-controlled Sasquatch, but is then on the verge of losing against whatever is pulling Brian's strings, the Big Bad of the story, when whatever it is assumes direct control of Sasquatch.

I might be completely wrong but I think it fits pretty well with the momentum shifts during the fight, and no doubt we will learn more in the next couple of issues with Hulk now carrying Brian's persona inside him (which is a nice recalling of the PAD run circa Heroes Reborn/Return when Hulk was haunted by Brian's ghost).


ICT / Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« on: September 06, 2018, 04:52:47 PM »
Something new does not mean more powerful.

In the context of this statement though Brian is referencing power though so I think you are far too quick to disregard it as a possibility. Comparing him to Tanaraq is a red herring, Brian is commenting on Walter not being able to use the full power he theoretically has access to.

Not much different when wolverines claws cut Hulk. He can heal from it without showing blood. buuuuuut in the panel of the claws going in blood is flying out from the wound and sas is pushing him down due to the motion lines so would make sense would jet out (Above hulks head and below sas' hand...another above and below reference :P). When hulk pulls sasquatch hand out of his chest you can see blood shoot out again. Other claw attacks clearly showed blood too. 

Actually I think you can count on one hand the number of times that Logan has actually stabbed Hulk straight up like that (off the top of my head it's really only the Fixit fight and that weird one a few years ago where he put all six claws straight through Hulk's brain).

The blood in the air during the first fingers in chest scene isn't Hulk's, it's coming from Sasquatch's mouth (which was bleeding from the opening exchange). The blood is coloured red; Hulk's blood is green throughout the issue. Agreed that Hulk does clearly bleed from later claw attacks.

I'd also like to address the strawman you made earlier (and then repeated on KMC as if it was something I had actually said myself) that the claws were akin to kryptonite and Hulk was uniquely weak to them. That's not what I argued. I do think that it is pretty reasonable to think that something more was going on other than just Sasquatch being really strong so the claws cutting easily, given Brian drawing explicit attention to how it's not normal for Hulk to be hurt like this. The bottom line is Sasquatch was victim of a supernatural spiritual possession, so there's plenty of room for strange things happening (Hulk being sliced open more easily than he might otherwise be for example).

Not at all, the whole speech is "every light casts a shadow. In every mirror...there is a reflection. As above..so below. take a good look my special boy. You'll see a darker shadow then yours. Gamma made Langkowski your equal. He just didn't use it, that's all. Do you? Do you understand? what needs to be done? I smell the sick and the weak! I smell the children! how many? How many do I have to--"

It's a continuation to what he was saying about walter wasn't using it properly and be the darker reflection (so below part). He wanted to be the darker shadow and kill people (since in Brian’s mind banner is a murderer). Remember how Hulk said earlier Walter didn't have it in him to kill? While Brian always felt bruce was a true monster. He was going to take it further. So if he is a murderer, his reflection (hulk) is just as bad. Even in the past Walter had dynamic strength and as mentioned could pull more power from Tanaraq. He even can become Tanaraq, so I highly doubt Brian can tap more into Tanaraq's body then Tanaraq himself. That literally would make zero sense. Also how would Brian know that exactly? Did he absorb walters memories and thoughts? More then likely he was directly referring to Walters lack of capacity to kill and not a true mirror of Brians version of Banner. Since you know....Banner killed his dad  :o

Hulk doesn't, Ewing has made Hulk go out of the way for him not to do that. Buuuuut as mentioned Brian always felt banner was a true monster. In the story they kept mentioning walter and bruce are the same, same energy, same background, etc. ie. mirror of each other. So again if he is a murderer, his reflection is just as bad. With all the killing Brian actually yells at the reporter "remember all this...is the monsters fault". So yeah killing people in Brians mind is a reflection of Hulk.  Hulk even comments earlier Walter doesn't have it in him to kill, while now Brian does. So Brian is  using his true capabilities ie kill which is what Brian even directly was referring to in the quote above

The fact that part of that speech actually questions whether Hulk knows "what needs to be done" makes it pretty clear that this isn't the only thing that is being referenced. Again, the Tanaraq thing is a red herring because the comment refers to Walter, not Tanaraq.

And for the record, I don't actually think that speech is Brian talking at all. Immediately before that Brian's control seems to slip and he suggests there is something grander behind the possession and even asks for help. Hulk questions what it is ("What does? Tell me! What's behind you?"), which is when whatever is in control of Sasquatch gains the advantage and starts the speech about dark mirrors etc. We'll have to wait for subsequent issues on this point but I suspect there is something bigger and nastier pulling the strings of Brian and that is who we are seeing in that exchange.

Again symbolism and metaphor.

Indeed Walter theorized that "I was a jock, remember? I worked out. I was twice as strong as bruce easily. So, the thinking went, my Hulk could counter his-create a deterrent for Canada. For the World..."

However, Ewing was going for a copy of Bruce which coincides with what Banner said "but the gamma-affected we have a very unique signatures and walter's is just like mine", later he also says....."walter...he wanted to turn himself into a second Hulk. You see? His gamma signature is just like mine. Exactly like mine and now the suns gone down. Its night. and the night is his time" Clearly Ewing was portraying walter was a copy and mirror of Banner and the Hulk. As above, so below. Even had him become Immortal Sasquatch

I'm aware of what was said. I referenced all of these comments.

None of them state or suggest that Hulk and Sasquatch had equal power levels; just a replicated origin.

Because walter is half magic and half gamma. wasn't meant as an insult to himself or talking about overall power.

Let's be clear here - you've just completely made that interpretation of that comment up.

But interesting you will take that as fact, but dismiss walters other comments. hmmmm....:P

I didn't take it as a fact. I actually stated quite clearly that "There is never a comment one way or the other on power levels". Which is absolutely true. I just presented it as part of the total picture from that issue.

And given the way you just hand-waved away the comment from Walter that doesn't support your favoured position, you should be careful about casting aspersions. People in glass houses and all that.

Everything I say is with respect of course. Always like a civil discussion :)

Do you even Herochat bro?!



ICT / Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« on: September 05, 2018, 05:34:59 PM »
I disagree. Nothing new for a character that has dynamic strength and powered by an elder god *shrugs*

Except it is quite clearly stated by Brian that this *is* something new. The context of that statement makes it clear that Sasquatch never utilised his power fully until now.

He was using symbolism with the claws. Wasn’t like some sort of krypnonite against him.

I'm not so sure. The first time he stabs him especially it looks like he just reaches out and his hand goes right into Hulk's chest. Hulk doesn't even bleed from it.

FWIW, Hulk seemingly overpowers Sasquatch in the grappling in that scene arm vs arm (this is before Hulk realises he is Brian and collapses mentally).

At any rate, whether Brian was talking symbolically or not: every one of Hulk's powers (durability, strength etc) are connected to his mental state. The fact that Brian produces an almost unique effect on the Hulk's mental state (abject terror and will to resist drained away almost completely) is pretty clearly a relevant factor aside from anything else.

He also wasn’t referring to direct power he meant wasn’t using it properly as in kill weak people. Goes on about that afterwards. Basically you have all this power and your using it the wrong way and you should be a god, etc

I think you are filling in a lot of blanks there from what is actually said by Brian.

The context of the initial statement is that Sasquatch had all the power of the Hulk but until now never actually used it.

Seeing as the Hulk doesn't go around killing people it doesn't seem very plausible that this is the key factor, and it is certainly not stated as such.

Even before banners dad took over banner said they were equals issue prior.

Banner never states that they are equals. He states that Walter's gamma signature is the same as his own, which makes sense given that Walter was explicitly attempting to replicate what happened to Banner. There is never a comment one way or the other on power levels. Walter notes that the original theory was that he would be an effective counter to Hulk as he was stronger than pre-transformation Bruce, but that was just a theory (and didn't take into account the psychological aspect of Banner's power). Walter actually refers to himself as "half-a-Hulk" at the beginning of the issue.


ICT / Re: New comic stuff worth talking about but not worth its own thread
« on: September 05, 2018, 04:53:14 PM »
Just read the issue and it seems pretty clear to me that there's a lot more to this than just Sasquatch being really strong, sorry to rain on your parade there KM. Brian Banner is pretty clearly a key aspect of his excellent performance here.

Brian basically states it outright - "Feel that? My claws in your gut? That's the proof! Who else could ever hurt you like this?" (on a couple of occasions the art looks like the fingers go straight into Hulk's body without any kind of forceful impact to emphasise that comment).

Then you have the comment about Walter never having known how to use his power.

It's also worth observing that Hulk is clearly psyched out for a good chunk of the fight after realised it is Brian Banner, and is literally crawling away with a hushed voice pleading for him to stay back. Not exactly Hulk at his best (although he does seem to stage a mental recovery prior to the conclusion of the fight, I think he is deluding himself when he says that Brian doesn't scare the Hulk... given his own reaction here, and previously the reaction of Savage, Grey and Gravage Hulks to Brian - every incarnation has consistently shit their pants and almost lost the will to resist whenever they have encountered him).


Marvel Zombies / Re: Immortal Hulk
« on: August 30, 2018, 07:20:22 PM »
Preview for the Hulk vs Sasquatch fight - looks like Walter is possessed by Tanaraq or A.N. Other:

Also some preview art from the Hulk vs Avengers fight coming up. Looks like poor Thor is set to get flattened again in what is rapidly becoming one of the most one-sided "rivalries" in comics:


ICT / Re: Nate Grey ( shaman) vs Martian Manhunter
« on: August 28, 2018, 05:45:38 PM »
From what I recall, vaguely, Nate was pretty uber in his own series as he went Shaman. However, he'd often show up after that in other books, in theory still at that power level, and not get treated as beyond other elite top tiers--maybe even worse than them.

I don't think he showed up in any other books apart from his own at his Shaman levels, although I might be misremembering. He "died" (sort of) not long after the power-up and didn't return until a couple of years ago, and even then at drastically reduced power levels.

Pre-Shaman Nate was generally treated as a step below the elite top tiers (Hulk punched through his TK shields easily enough for example) but he had a lot of crazy high lip service and some great feats. Overall I'd peg him in a similar ballpark to someone like post-Annihilation Nova; generally presented as below the elite top tier but capable of bursts of power at or perhaps even beyond the conventional elite.

Shaman Nate was more consistent and a lot more skilled with his powers. I think he's very comparable to Uber Cable, who lost to Surfer but with a lot of context involved and was previously implied to be beyond any Earth-based hero or villain at the time. So not outside of the batting range of an elite top tier, especially if given a respectful showing like Surfer was, but probably a tall ask for someone like J'Onn who's main role is to lose to people to make it clear that they are an elite level threat.


Marvel Zombies / Re: What are Spider-Man's best fight scenes?
« on: August 22, 2018, 03:13:55 PM »
I loved that trilogy when I was younger. Completely forgot they even existed, good call! Sure I've got them all somewhere sitting around, might have to dig them out again.


ICT / Re: Most formidable sub-class 100 brick
« on: July 25, 2018, 04:16:04 PM »
Bit of a cheat answer as he does have the capacity to become a class 100 given sufficient provocation, but Joe Fixit is worth a mention as he likely isn't a true class 100 most of the time but made a living out of cheating wins out of top end class 100 bricks by being a cunning fucker.


Marvel Zombies / Re: Immortal Hulk
« on: July 23, 2018, 07:07:49 AM »
I won  :)

Stopped him with a body shot in the last round, unbelievable buzz  8)


Marvel Zombies / Re: Immortal Hulk
« on: July 17, 2018, 02:58:41 PM »
Buenas Suerte Amigo! You know anything about the guy you're fighting?

Boxing will always be my greatest love.

Cheers Bandido (and others!). I don't know much about him really. He's an inch taller than me apparently but a bit lighter naturally, I've seen some pictures of him and he looks a bit lighter built than me. Saw a very brief clip of his last fight but nowhere near enough to judge off of. He's had a few more than me but this is only my third fight so I'd expect that to be the case. Will let you know how it goes!


Marvel Zombies / Re: Immortal Hulk
« on: July 15, 2018, 10:38:22 AM »
How'd your fight go btw?

Haven't had it yet, it's a week today (22nd July).


Marvel Zombies / Re: Immortal Hulk
« on: July 13, 2018, 05:25:00 PM »
no i just think i would remember a giant green guy that has been on tv for years,tearing up places,fighting monsters,gods,superheroes etc,when seeing him up close,& personal.

To be fair Hulk did pretty much ninja the group, not sure many if any of them got a clear sight apart from the one he crippled and put into a coma who obviously isn't talking any time soon.

But I do get what you mean and I'm glad Ewing isn't going to drag out the "is Hulk back?" thing for too long judging by the solicits for the next few issues.


Marvel Zombies / Re: Immortal Hulk
« on: July 13, 2018, 05:22:59 PM »
So is Hulk speaking, does he remember the events of Sakaar through Doc Green? Or is this the Brooding - "Rarghhh" monster?

Hulk is speaking a lot. He's extremely intelligent (he's at least genius-level according to Banner) but also extraordinarily brutal and monstrously calculating. Somewhere between the more sadistic portrayals of Joe Fixit and the Punisher personality wise so far basically.

No idea if he remembers the events of Sakaar, not sure why you'd expect those to come up in the first two issues of a fresh title launch. I've no doubt Al Ewing remembers though, he's a continuity buff and has already included some incredibly obscure Hulk continuity references in the first couple of issues.


Marvel Zombies / Re: Immortal Hulk
« on: July 06, 2018, 04:40:17 PM »
Not too worried about a lack of smashing. It's only two issues and we've had plenty of Hulk screen time, I don't need a rampage or a big fight every issue.

Based on the Hulk smashing Ewing wrote in No Surrender and the solicits for upcoming issues (a fight with the Avengers and some big fights promised) I'm happy to give Ewing plenty of time to build.


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