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Entertainment => Music, Movies, Tv and Books => Topic started by: Prime on November 14, 2017, 10:27:21 AM

Title: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 14, 2017, 10:27:21 AM
Pre-emptively making the thread. Won't be seeing this until Friday in the early afternoon.

Although this spoilery review seems fairly legit:
https://youtu.be/4SqHV6zK5ac
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 14, 2017, 01:20:50 PM
I will be seeing this Thursday at 6 west US time.

Spoilers are everywhere already and the post credits scenes have leaked.

Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 14, 2017, 10:41:51 PM
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bbfw48ygGqn/?taken-by=justiceleague

Aquaman taking it to Steppenwolf.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: XerxesTWD on November 14, 2017, 10:58:34 PM
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bbfw48ygGqn/?taken-by=justiceleague (https://www.instagram.com/p/Bbfw48ygGqn/?taken-by=justiceleague)

Aquaman taking it to Steppenwolf.
I can't believe he completely laid Steppenwolf out with a single hit. WTF?!
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 15, 2017, 10:34:25 AM
Early reviews seem to bounce between "flawed but fun" to "bloated and unnecessary". General consensus is

- not as bad as BvS
- The Flash is a standout
- Cyborg is super boring
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Ditto on November 15, 2017, 10:35:39 AM
I saw metacritic had it at about 51 percent and flixster had it at about 48 percent. Rotten tomatoes has delayed their scores.

Also it’s projected to make 75 million less world wide than BvS.

I’m afraid to go see it.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Abhilegend on November 15, 2017, 11:25:01 AM
Superman is pretty OP as per some spoilers.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: XerxesTWD on November 15, 2017, 11:41:55 AM
Most of the reviews are calling this a tonal reboot. If you skip MoS and BvS you won't be missing much because anything relevant from those is referenced accordingly and Whedon essentially saved the franchise.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 15, 2017, 12:04:10 PM
Many reviewers are citing that they got the heroes very right in this including Superman but  Steppenwolf is also pointed out as being alright at best, bad by many.

Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 15, 2017, 12:07:06 PM
In terms of raw footage about 15% of the film is Whedon apparently:

Quote
“The goal is to make sure when you’re watching the movie, it all feels cohesive. That imprint that Joss had, some aspect of it is going to come out in the direction, but the actors are already pretty much down the road on their arcs. Let’s just say 80, 85 percent of the movie is what was originally shot. There’s only so much you can do with other 15, 20 percent of the movie.”

A lot can change in the editing however (like the fact that Whedon apparently cut Luthor/Eisenberg completely out of the film).
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Master on November 15, 2017, 12:10:45 PM
Here is what I heard from some people who saw an advanced screening on Monday:

Waaaaay better than BvS. Much closer in quality to WW, and we get another DCCU history lesson from the Amazons. Quick cameo of an alien GL fighting a battle with Earth allies against a prior Steppenwolf invasion.

Overall good action and CGI, but at times, Superman has noticeable lip CGIing to hide Cavil’s mustache. Also a few scenes where they go from on location to blatant green screen... probably because of Whedon doing some additional shots. The movie has a quick mention of some Atlantis stuff (beyond the main mother box plot) that likely hints at the Aquaman movie.

Flash is funny but relatively new to being a hero. Steppenwolf was described as “sassy” at times, but they couldn’t explain to me what exactly made him sassy. These people hated BvS, so this was a fairly glowing review.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 15, 2017, 12:13:44 PM
Way better than BvS and SS is what I'm hearing too.   That is a win at this point.

There is no way Snyder should have anymore involvement in the DCEU going forward.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 15, 2017, 12:51:27 PM
http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2017/11/15/justice_league_review_roundup_critics_on_the_latest_dc_comics_movie.html
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 15, 2017, 01:24:56 PM
This whole "Rotten Tomatoes is intentionally holding back JLs score as long as possible" story is...interesting:

https://forums.boxofficetheory.com/topic/24625-justice-league-november-17-2017-review-embargo-has-lifted-pg511-for-the-daring-no-spoilers-allowed/?do=findComment&comment=3249317

(https://forums.boxofficetheory.com/applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=https://images.plurk.com/32HCve9J4ee7TQ4LaTx.png&key=c108ccc6cc62b8455b82eb8ec597ef7bc9cced1a775b405e0266f77ab734883c)
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 15, 2017, 02:09:28 PM
http://comicbook.com/dc/2017/11/15/justice-league-rotten-tomatoes-score-leaks/

Dropping.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: superlurker on November 15, 2017, 02:39:33 PM
There was a leaked clip that's down now of Superman owning the rest of the League. Best part of the scene was probably when Flash was doing his speed thing and then notices that Superman can see him even though everyone else are like statues, which makes Flash sport a cute "oh shit" expression. Wonder Woman loses a headbutt contest against him, and Batman bleeds.

A lot can change in the editing however (like the fact that Whedon apparently cut Luthor/Eisenberg completely out of the film).

Luthor is apparently in a post-credit scene assembling an evil League of Evil, meeting up with Deathstroke for that.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 15, 2017, 04:57:00 PM
This actually premiered last night in Korea and I didn't realize it.  We probably won't get around to watching it until Sunday as we have a huge Thanksgiving banquet to go to on Saturday and tomorrow is Punisher.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 15, 2017, 09:54:40 PM
ICT is going nuclear tomorrow.

Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: superlurker on November 15, 2017, 10:10:45 PM
http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510794279083.webm

http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510793398771.webm
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 15, 2017, 10:33:48 PM
That cgi looks like shit.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 15, 2017, 11:17:26 PM
http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510794279083.webm

http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510793398771.webm
Where did you get that?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: XerxesTWD on November 15, 2017, 11:25:35 PM
http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510794279083.webm

http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510793398771.webm
Where did you get that?
He's a member of the Pirate Party in Iceland.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 15, 2017, 11:40:20 PM
http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510794279083.webm

http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510793398771.webm

Is that the extent of the fight?  I was expecting a bigger brawl between the team and evil Supes.  I figured there would be at least three buildings toppled between Superman and Wonder Woman alone.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: superlurker on November 16, 2017, 07:50:29 AM
http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510794279083.webm

http://i.4cdn.org/co/1510793398771.webm

Is that the extent of the fight?  I was expecting a bigger brawl between the team and evil Supes.  I figured there would be at least three buildings toppled between Superman and Wonder Woman alone.

The fight goes like Superman standing around after being revived, not being quite himself, being approached by Aquaman, Cyborg, Flash and Wonder Woman. Cyborg's tech senses aggression in Superman, so it decides to shoot at him in self-defense, which starts the fight after Wonder Woman fails to talk him down with a heartfelt "Kal-El". Aquaman, Cyborg and Wonder Woman try to restrain Superman while Flash starts super-speeding to get behind him. Everything is standing still from Flash's perspective, but then he notices Superman's eye is moving and Superman pushes the other three off and starts to chase Flash around a bit at super-speed, eventually tripping him over. Batman appears (jogging on foot, in broad daylight, probably putting a lot of fear into the cowardly and superstitious) a bit after most of them have been punted off or whatever and calls out "Clark", which gets his attention. Wonder Woman tries to block him from getting at Batman with the "don't make me do this" routine, but loses in that headbutt contest. Finally he grabs Batman and does the "do you bleed?" routine before Batman is saved by Alfred bringing in his "big gun", Lois Lane, which calms Superman down. They're all calling him "Clark" in front of the police and stuff at this point.

The rest of the League obviously weren't trying very hard, but Superman wasn't exactly throwing the kinds of punches he did against Zod either. Without any other context, which may change things, he looked pretty dominant all things considered.

Supposedly, one part of the scene also involves them forgetting all about the Mother Box they used to resurrect Superman, which the villain just picks up from a nearby car.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Gree on November 16, 2017, 08:09:56 AM
Kind of stupid to show him overpower the league
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 16, 2017, 08:25:46 AM
I always got the impression Superman would save Warth more or less solo anyway so I’m not surprised to see him beating up the entire Leafue.

Fangirl will flip her shit.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 16, 2017, 08:55:01 AM
Am hearing interesting things about the degree to which the attempt to CGI the moustache off of Cavill's face succeeded...I am intrigued.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: LiquidSailor on November 16, 2017, 09:17:59 AM

Luthor is apparently in a post-credit scene assembling an evil League of Evil, meeting up with Deathstroke for that.

They aren't still using Eisenjew/Jewsenberg for Luthor, are they?  He was the fucking absolute worst.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 16, 2017, 10:08:56 AM

Luthor is apparently in a post-credit scene assembling an evil League of Evil, meeting up with Deathstroke for that.

They aren't still using Eisenjew/Jewsenberg for Luthor, are they?  He was the fucking absolute worst.

Yes, they are.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 16, 2017, 12:32:58 PM
RT score is finally out - its 40% atm:

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/justice_league_2017
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 16, 2017, 12:36:44 PM
In other news this shit is safado-ing the fuck out of Brazil apparently:

Quote
Justice League had the highest opening day ever in Brazil (12,9M local currency), beating out Twilight:BD2 (11M), Civil War (10,1M) and BvS (9,2M). It is also the best start of 2017 by far, beating FF8 (7,8M).

 

https://omelete.uol.com.br/filmes/noticia/liga-da-justica-bate-todos-os-recordes-em-estreia-no-brasil-confira-os-numeros/
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Ditto on November 16, 2017, 02:39:33 PM
Safado is probably the only one actually watching it.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: XerxesTWD on November 16, 2017, 02:56:59 PM
Their best ranked movie was Twilight. Brazil is compromised.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 16, 2017, 04:29:06 PM
round the clock screenings with people bringing me food in the theater, I'm doing my part

Superman solo's Marvel :-)

All told I don't trust RT. I'm expecting to see it tonight and from everything I've heard what worked was the characterization (with one major complaint) and the plot was uneven. I expected that between Snyder doing 2/3 and Whedon another - that's two films in one so I'm not going to take T too seriously. I know I'm going to love this film but I'd be happy to see sDC get a little bit more love for the new tone its taking
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: XerxesTWD on November 16, 2017, 04:43:14 PM
It takes more than 15% of one movie to save this universe.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: superlurker on November 16, 2017, 05:01:29 PM
The full fight between Superman and the rest of the League, just in case someone wants to make a lot of money selling safado tissues.

https://streamable.com/2qkut
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Liam Gallaghers Unibrow on November 16, 2017, 05:11:36 PM
Superman pretty casually overpowering Diana in a straight test of strength there despite using one arm vs her two. He looks waaaay beyond the other Leaguers there.

As an aside, some of that CGI looks pretty ropey to say the least.


Cheers.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Gree on November 16, 2017, 05:44:14 PM
That’s some pretty shit acting all around
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 16, 2017, 05:53:29 PM
I liked that Flash still looked quite a bit Faster.

And Aquaman got one shotted lol
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: HalloweenJack on November 16, 2017, 06:37:40 PM
shoulda said 'Martha'
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Master on November 16, 2017, 07:39:53 PM
That return/fight scene is decent, but Cyborg’s CGI is horrendous. Holy shit.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 16, 2017, 09:23:12 PM
The movie was a better than ok! The Superman we got from the point of him showing up for the fight till the end is the Superman I've been smashing for!
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: scourge on November 16, 2017, 09:25:55 PM
Sucks that this movie is going to suck. Still going to see it
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 16, 2017, 09:30:59 PM
As a Superman fanboy, I loved that he finally got his Superman power moment - that was cool

On an aside, everything else was just about what I'd heard

The best part was the characterization - in just 7 minutes or so the characters managed to be funny, endearing and show who they are - WW was noble and courageous, Flash was funny (Pet Cemetery - the look on his face when he realizes he has a speed peer), Batman was quippy, Aquaman was hilarious.

Every review I've read has pointed out the film's unevenness, the bland genericness of Steppenwolf, and the obvious mistakes of things ike CGI'ing Cavill's porn star mustache etc....

On the other hand reviews have also pointed out the film's strength is in the characterization of each hero and the chemistry between them. I think I could see that in the clip. The audience was having fun - I think it's going to be a fun watch.

Cavill slipped into his British accent for a second there - I'm pretty psyched to see this tomorrow.

I hope this film gets some box office love. Looks far more light-hearted than the other (non WW) somber fare
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on November 16, 2017, 09:55:50 PM
Looks like this is the EOL for DC movies except Wonder Woman.

They will likely still go for Aquaman and/or Flash (then again with critics and fans taking the exit beeline from WB churning out a good movie)... but another League movie will likely have movie goers saying "Pass".

As almost all critics review and observation, the DCEU has been built on the foundation of melancholy and despair. Take a look at this samples when they united:

Avengers. Audience reaction: CLAP! CLAP! CLAP! <tweet!>

GotG: Audience reaction: "Yeah!"

Justice League: :| (muted response).

The only time a DCEU film got a reaction was when Wonder Woman made her battle entrance in BvS. Even the CWC heroes do better than their WB counterparts when they come out in groups.

I fault Warner Bros for never understanding DC Comics. They gave Zac Shitder too much leeway in building a dark and despair-ridden universe and now this has passed on to the League.

Hopefully, Patty J will continue to stay away from all of Shitder's universe and make her own path.

In DCEU, the "S" doesn't stand for Hope. It's stands for "Despair".
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Big Daddy Longstroke on November 16, 2017, 10:48:03 PM
So was that Zeus hurling lightning at Steppenwolf?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 16, 2017, 10:52:38 PM
Yeah he was listed in the credits. I enjoyed the few second we got of a GL.

Steppenwolf seemed like a significantly lesser threat at the end then when he was running ham on the Amazon's, Atlanteans, a couple of God's and a GL.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 16, 2017, 11:21:15 PM
Did we watch the same clip?

The audience was losing their collective shit, hooting and hollering, and that scene alone is worth the price of admission. ALA spoilers I know that Superman turns good, makes a grand entrance against Steeppenwolf, gets a lighter colored suit and the scene ends with batman making a funny joke. Even Aquaman was funny (stand out funny) getting one shotted "he's not ok!?!"

Everyone going into this film knew it was the official end of the Snyderverse and that Wonder Woman and Patty Jenkins are the beginning of new DC - the color pallette from this clip is cleaner than every DC film before this, the next two movies are James Wan - a winner of a director - and Aquaman, who by all accounts looks like he will redefine this character as underwater Thor (Ragnarok the fun one)

I have no idea how Shazam will shake out but the DCEU plan going forward - JL has been made and now they will find the best talent to make character driven films - sounds good.

Even the die-hard Marvel fanboys who normally loathe DC films have been giving grades like  pretty good to solidly entertaijning which coming from them is a glowing review

I even liked CYborg in that one clip.

Most distractingly bad thing in the film is Ben Affleck's personal life - otherwise solid win all around. Hell, Man of Steel 2 is looking like a win as well. With the new, hopeful portrayal, the due respect he's getting as fucking Superman, and likely Brainiac as a villain - it looks promising if a good director is found.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 16, 2017, 11:45:21 PM
Things got much better in this especially the characters but by no means perfect.

Post credits scenes were top notch.

I look forward to a post Snyder DCEU.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on November 17, 2017, 12:10:46 AM
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/justice_league_2017/

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/marvels_the_avengers

This is like Reggie Strickland vs Muhd Ali in their prime.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on November 17, 2017, 12:37:07 AM
Btw, in all the Michael Bay CGI Expo, that I got lost through the flash and bangs... what was the reason why Growlingwolf wanted to destroy the Earth?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Rynox on November 17, 2017, 01:44:13 AM
Did we watch the same clip?

The audience was losing their collective shit, hooting and hollering, and that scene alone is worth the price of admission. ALA spoilers I know that Superman turns good, makes a grand entrance against Steeppenwolf, gets a lighter colored suit and the scene ends with batman making a funny joke. Even Aquaman was funny (stand out funny) getting one shotted "he's not ok!?!"

Everyone going into this film knew it was the official end of the Snyderverse and that Wonder Woman and Patty Jenkins are the beginning of new DC - the color pallette from this clip is cleaner than every DC film before this, the next two movies are James Wan - a winner of a director - and Aquaman, who by all accounts looks like he will redefine this character as underwater Thor (Ragnarok the fun one)

I have no idea how Shazam will shake out but the DCEU plan going forward - JL has been made and now they will find the best talent to make character driven films - sounds good.

Even the die-hard Marvel fanboys who normally loathe DC films have been giving grades like  pretty good to solidly entertaijning which coming from them is a glowing review

I even liked CYborg in that one clip.

Most distractingly bad thing in the film is Ben Affleck's personal life - otherwise solid win all around. Hell, Man of Steel 2 is looking like a win as well. With the new, hopeful portrayal, the due respect he's getting as fucking Superman, and likely Brainiac as a villain - it looks promising if a good director is found.

Have you considered a career in public relations? I think you've got what it takes.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Strange on November 17, 2017, 02:03:27 AM
Jesus, I'm going to go see this but that footage looked awful.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Insane Titan on November 17, 2017, 05:52:41 AM
My God The JL looked weak as shit against Superman.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 17, 2017, 11:21:15 AM
Film is flopping big time. Well deserved after the Snyder shit show.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 17, 2017, 04:16:15 PM
Just saw the movie. It was good, a bit too short. Finally get a properly written Superman. Superman is pretty clearly depicted to be in a League of his own compared to the rest of the team, Wonder Woman included. Definitely gives you the impression that Superman could beat Steppenwolf all on his own. Cyborg cgi was up and down. Aquaman and Flash were great. This movie could have used another half hour of character development. But good movie all in all. 4 out of 5 stars for me.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 17, 2017, 04:22:13 PM
Its a big improvement over BVS with Superman and Flash being the standouts.  I liked Cyborg more than I thought and Momoa was good for what he had.

Now they need to take their time and get these characters even more fleshed out.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 17, 2017, 04:31:22 PM
Same here as it pertains to Cyborg. Even though I went in with low expectations, Cyborg was actually really good. All of the individual characters were good honestly.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 17, 2017, 04:33:20 PM
That made the movie for me.  The JL really stood out.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: XerxesTWD on November 17, 2017, 05:05:44 PM
Btw, in all the Michael Bay CGI Expo, that I got lost through the flash and bangs... what was the reason why Growlingwolf wanted to destroy the Earth?
There was something about creating a hyperspace bypass and Earth was in the way.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 17, 2017, 05:11:43 PM
The demolition plans were posted in Alpha Centauri. Its the humans fault for not getting involved in local affairs.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 17, 2017, 06:24:11 PM
So where are we, battle board wise?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 17, 2017, 06:33:53 PM
Superman is clearly a cut above Wonder Woman. Superman has genuine super speed and not speed bursts like some idiots on here kept saying because of how super speed was depicted in man of steel. Superman debuted his freezing breath to freeze Steppenwolf's axe so Diana could shatter it.

Amber Heard's smoking hot rating is over 9000. Positively boneriffic.

Flash is pretty fast it seems, but is super awkward and gets tripped up a lot. Also has none of the esoteric speed force abilities. He is basically run really fast and gives off a ton of electricity man.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 17, 2017, 07:10:12 PM
Its too early to be very accurate but it seems to be heading towards a $97 million opening weekend.

To put that in perspective
 - its about the same as the first Iron Man movie (and much less when you factor in a decades worth of ticket inflation)
 - its less than Man of Steels $116 million
 - it would be less than Wonder Woman, Spiderman Homecoming, Thor Ragnarok, GOTG 2 though higher than Logan

http://deadline.com/2017/11/justice-league-opening-weekend-box-office-lower-thor-ragnarok-wonder-the-star-1202211094/

Anyway we'll have to see how this plays out but if its comes in under $100 million and the legs are about what you expect then i think the consequences for the DCEU going forwards could well be pretty major (and not just in a "more jokes"/"different directors" way).
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 17, 2017, 07:25:27 PM
It could even do sub-$90 million at this point.  A huge flop.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 17, 2017, 07:46:56 PM
Superman is far faster than WW and nearly on par with the Flash.  He easily overpowered the entire league and later Steppenwolf.

He carried with ease and entire apartment building and pulled apart the motherboxes.

Bruce referenced him as stronger than a planet.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 17, 2017, 08:18:10 PM
Stronger than a planet, lol
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 17, 2017, 08:41:15 PM
That's just accurate, "comic book" jargon for plot-device strength. Supes is Top Dog in any universe, period.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 17, 2017, 08:52:32 PM
http://comicbook.com/dc/2017/11/16/justice-league-box-office-thor-ragnarok-warner-brothers-competition/

Fatality
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Gree on November 17, 2017, 09:42:08 PM
Superman is far faster than WW and nearly on par with the Flash.  He easily overpowered the entire league and later Steppenwolf.

He carried with ease and entire apartment building and pulled apart the motherboxes.

Bruce referenced him as stronger than a planet.

What is the point of the team then
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Master on November 17, 2017, 09:50:34 PM
Spoil me  After Supes is resurrected, why doesn’t he just solo Step?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 17, 2017, 10:06:31 PM
Spoil me  After Supes is resurrected, why doesn’t he just solo Step?

From what I'm hearing
SPOILERS
SPOILERS
SPOILERS
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
 .
.
.
.
 .
 .
.
.
.
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He basically does.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: superlurker on November 17, 2017, 10:33:32 PM
What is the point of the team then

To resurrect Superman, so he can come flying in and easily save them when they're getting their asses kicked.

Other than that, the team is there to show that Superman is stronger than all of them put together, that he's about as fast as Flash and that when Flash rescues a car with four people, Superman rescues an entire apartment block; that he can ask about menstruation habits just like Batman and is a better man than Batman in general; that he stands for truth (and justice too) so they don't really need Wonder Woman's lasso of truth (or a league for justice); that he can single-handedly and easily beat up the bad guy that gave the team a hard time (after saving the aforementioned apartment block he basically comes back and goes "is this guy still giving you a hard time?" and proceeds to beat Steppenwolf up); and that he has to pull apart the doomsday plot device, the disassembly of which was originally basically Cyborg's one job to justify being on the team. Aquaman doesn't even talk to fish anyway, so he basically gave up without even trying to look useful.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 17, 2017, 10:35:07 PM
From a box office POV huge change is inevitable. The films aren't making Marvel "oh, another billion...cool" money but they are consistently getting into the 500-900 million dollar area. That is way too much money to stop making DC films.

What we have seen is that DC is getting it right in characterization, costumes (how many Harley Quinns did we see at Halloween?), and has the seeds for great franchises

We've also seen that when great directors are given free reign to make great films - they do. patty Jenkins made a WW that is getting legit Oscar buzz. Suicide Squad was a hot, burning mess - but Harwely Quinn and arguably Deadshot were legit stars as is Viola Davis.

My guess is that DC will worry less about continuity and just worry about making individual one-off films. Cavill looks to have nailed it as Superman (I've seen mostly spilers not the movie - about 9 minutes worth of clips) MOS 2 will likely be a more cosmic Brainiac story.

James Wan has everything necessary to make a smash Aquaman if he can reign in Jason Mamoa's worst instincts and stay on target.

WW is already a success.

Ironically Batman is doing horribly - I hate to say it but Affleck is not helping, Jared Leto was one of two disastrous casting choices (Zukcerberg?) and Affleck the individual is overshadowing the character

Ezra Miller could do a solid Flash movie with a great scriot and director and I've heard good things about Cyborg.

In short, it feels like the death knell for the Synderverse but turning the page into a classic, DC archetypal, mythological universe that can draw real talent to mythological style hero's.

Martin fucking Scorcese wanted to do a Joker movie . If Warner let's the creative have real control I think the lighter tone of the movie could sell the DC fans and possibly convicne the die hard marvels to give the new stuff a shot - if Dc doubles down on the all flash no substance dire Snyder-verse, yeah it's done. I just saw a clip of the end credits scene and Superman s color palette finally changed so I am cautiously optimistic
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 17, 2017, 10:43:01 PM
I agree about focusing on solos at this point to try and repair the damage.  I would also not mind Ben being recast. 

Flashpoint could be a soft reboot of the whole thing.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: superlurker on November 17, 2017, 10:54:10 PM
Spoil me  After Supes is resurrected, why doesn’t he just solo Step?

He takes a bit of time spent with Lois Lane (the thirstiest woman he ever met, according to Ma Kent) to get his brain properly rebooted. He's a bit fussy on the details before that, so he just kicks the League's ass and flies away with Lois Lane.

After that, he shows up and saves the day just as the fight against Steppenwolf was going pretty badly for the team. 

Basically, Steppenwolf is like a Discount Zod who only showed up because Superman was dead (which made the world turn to fearful, despairing shit).

The movie is sort of like two hours of Superman wanking. I guess this is because the movie both has to serve to introduce the League and to be the scene of Superman's resurrection, which are pretty much mutually exclusive goals because the former requires showing why teamwork is necessary to face a common threat but the latter requires showing why Superman is so special to make it more than just reviving some random team member.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 17, 2017, 11:19:19 PM
I agree.

Flashpoint could keep everything thats working and dump everything that isn't

Drop Affleck, wake up in a DCverse where Superman has a ligh4ter palette, WW is WW, James Wan directs Aquaman, And the Rock makes an awesome Black Adam appearance

I'd laos like to point out that it's early to predict JL doom here. The Fast and the Furious cleared 1 billion but barely made 200 million domestically.

If JL underperforms domestically and does a standout job abroad it could hit a healthy 800 million. If it has kegs, and to be honest, I'm niot hearing many "it's awful reviews, it could eke out a better total if it does alright domestically.

The current DC films aren't going to make Marvel/Disney money - there will have to be a lot of reconfiguring for that - it could eventually get there if the good is kept and the rest is dropped (seriously Affleck - how could you torpedo this)

If JL beats Suicide Squad it isn't a disaster. If it picks up a little steam - it might suprise us
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Strawman Abridged on November 18, 2017, 12:27:32 AM
Btw, in all the Michael Bay CGI Expo, that I got lost through the flash and bangs... what was the reason why Growlingwolf wanted to destroy the Earth?
There was something about creating a hyperspace bypass and Earth was in the way.

The pesky backwater Earth natives were obstructing Darkseid's plans for a cosmic Keystone Pipeline, if you will.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 18, 2017, 02:38:09 AM
Thor:Ragnorak is looking to wipe its ass with the opening of JL.  In fact the opening won't even be close.

The DCEU is dead, bury it.  Disney/Marvel will show no mercy.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: altoon on November 18, 2017, 03:18:38 AM
Let's wait the early bo has been wrong before.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 18, 2017, 05:25:53 AM
From a box office POV huge change is inevitable. The films aren't making Marvel "oh, another billion...cool" money but they are consistently getting into the 500-900 million dollar area. That is way too much money to stop making DC films.

...

In short, it feels like the death knell for the Synderverse but turning the page into a classic, DC archetypal, mythological universe that can draw real talent to mythological style hero's.

Martin fucking Scorcese wanted to do a Joker movie . If Warner let's the creative have real control I think the lighter tone of the movie could sell the DC fans and possibly convicne the die hard marvels to give the new stuff a shot - if Dc doubles down on the all flash no substance dire Snyder-verse, yeah it's done. I just saw a clip of the end credits scene and Superman s color palette finally changed so I am cautiously optimistic

I think this is overly optimistic. Its not like audiences have an endless appetite to go back and see WB try to get a cinematic DCU/Justice League right or like WB have a bottomless pot of gold with which to finance it. We are 5 films in now and BO returns seem to be significantly eroded by past failures. Nobody knows anything for now but rumours are that everything is on hold while WB watches what happens with JL - the exceptions being WW 2 (obvious reasons), Aquaman (already filmed), and Shazam (seen as sufficiently distant/independent from JL).

https://theplaylist.net/rumor-dc-wonder-woman-universe-20171117/

http://collider.com/the-batman-casting-rumors-matt-reeves

Basically WB feel that they made a mistake by going all in with a bunch of announcements/major decisions before they knew that they had a viable product/idea.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on November 18, 2017, 05:30:26 AM
Spoil me  After Supes is resurrected, why doesn’t he just solo Step?



The movie is sort of like two hours of Superman wanking. I guess this is because the movie both has to serve to introduce the League and to be the scene of Superman's resurrection, which are pretty much mutually exclusive goals because the former requires showing why teamwork is necessary to face a common threat but the latter requires showing why Superman is so special to make it more than just reviving some random team member.

One wonders why they are so determined to make one of their least interesting characters into the heart and soul of the movieverse?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 18, 2017, 09:30:05 AM
To their credit (Most likely Joss Whedon) the Superman we get from the point of him showing up for the big fight on is the Superman people want personality-wise.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Master on November 18, 2017, 10:59:23 AM
Well, I am glad to hear that. Maybe DC/WB will let Whedon do a Supes Movie. The man knows his comics and definitely keeps things light and fun. He may not give us the best Superman movie ever, but I think a solid 7.5/10 would help keep the franchise strong.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Master on November 18, 2017, 11:00:52 AM
Spoil me  After Supes is resurrected, why doesn’t he just solo Step?

He takes a bit of time spent with Lois Lane (the thirstiest woman he ever met, according to Ma Kent) to get his brain properly rebooted. He's a bit fussy on the details before that, so he just kicks the League's ass and flies away with Lois Lane.

After that, he shows up and saves the day just as the fight against Steppenwolf was going pretty badly for the team. 

Basically, Steppenwolf is like a Discount Zod who only showed up because Superman was dead (which made the world turn to fearful, despairing shit).

The movie is sort of like two hours of Superman wanking. I guess this is because the movie both has to serve to introduce the League and to be the scene of Superman's resurrection, which are pretty much mutually exclusive goals because the former requires showing why teamwork is necessary to face a common threat but the latter requires showing why Superman is so special to make it more than just reviving some random team member.

Next question: So Superman outperformed the combined power of a GL, the Amazons, Atlantis, and the Greek Gods?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 18, 2017, 11:19:06 AM
mmm No. There was a lot larger force that attacked Earth when the combined Army's faced off against Steppenwolf.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 18, 2017, 11:55:57 AM
Yeah, when Diana tells Batman the story of Steppenwolf she specifically says his mistake was attacking the earth first. This time around he would just go for the mother boxes in surgical strikes.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 18, 2017, 03:08:34 PM
I think the mistake is comparing DC to Marvel. Marvel is a Disney company, is well into an 18 film shared universe with people invested in the actors, olotline and future installmetns. It's a successful tv show in movie form acting on a larger scale

DC is still making a load of money. Suicide Squad - bad flick with bright spots in certain stand out characters - 850 million.
Wonder Woman - close to 900$, As bad as Superman batman was, its still a near 900 milion dollar film. That's not X Men money

BO numbers today had an enormous return internationally. What we see is that US audiences are demanding change and wny shouldn't they

Dreary, soulless Snyderverse

A batman who is in one day, out the nexct and maybe caught up in the Hollywood sex scandal. Battfleck is distracting - I liked him at first but I can't watch him without seeing Ben Affleck cosplaying and showing up in tabloids.

Films that are stylistically deaf to creators and controlled by studio mandate - Warner as a studio is immensely loyal to in-house talent which occasionally is an awful recipe for great filmmaking

I'm a little suprised that anyone thought this film would be anything other than lukewarm to good. Audience scores on RT were a solid B+.  Critics are getting a litle power hungry in how savage they're being with films. I get that the film isn't perfect, but lower than 40% is vindictive - although I don't know what the score is now

If people like the indivudal characters enough to follow the stand alones coming up while Flash Flashpoint can retcon things that don't work the film has done its job. Audiences are sophisticated - if DC clearly shifted its tone, Snyder is gone, and peoplle start hearing the right announcements the die-hard DC fans will come out - the real question will be casual moviegoers and the occasional Marvel die-hard

IMHO DC will regain the casual moviegoers and with effort, marvelites will join up partially. There's good stuff coming up

Aquaman, WW, Shazam future MOS and a new Batman plus Nightwing, and other potential projects are all potentially fantastic. hell, who would have thought Aquaman would have been reimagined and gotten a direvto rlike James Wan

This all feels very inevitable to me and its not as bad as I imagined. 83 millio today - 119 total and its Saturday afternoon. Global could end up at 200 million

I never thought DC had a chance against  THir comedy with Loki, Hulk and other Marvel superstars init. Marvel as of current has so many stars that every solo film with a team up is a de facto JL.

DC not getting the same BO isn't bad as long as the films make money - and they are, and the films are moving in a pisitive direction that fans will look forward to. Eventually they will have built up the goodwill that several years of a shared universe rbrings.



Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Rage.Of.Olympus on November 18, 2017, 03:49:20 PM
Why did Diana and Bruce act like Superman was one of their closest friends? It was so confusing.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 18, 2017, 03:54:14 PM
Because fighting a giant killer monster together forges an unbreakable bond or because WB/DC wants to cut corners. Take your pick.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: altoon on November 18, 2017, 04:01:07 PM
To their credit (Most likely Joss Whedon) the Superman we get from the point of him showing up for the big fight on is the Superman people want personality-wise.

Agreed though Batman seemed to take a step backwards for me. Overall I liked the heroes more or less (except for the flash just could get into the guy playing him) the story was really badly done and some really bad CGI (Cyborg hurt my eyes) and many points.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on November 18, 2017, 04:11:59 PM
Kay, just got back from seeing it.

The movie felt like a bit of a rip-off. Motherboxes in place of infinity gems. Batman resurrecting Superman out of guilt in place of Iron Man creating Vision out of guilt. (the resurrection even had a similar lightning scene to Vision's creation) Heroes saving civilians while fighting the bad guy at the same time.

So yeah, a big rip-off, but that wasn't really its problem imo. All superhero movies are pretty formulaic, after all. No, what killed it was a lack of charisma from the actors.

 I never bought Batfleck's guilt the way I did Stark's guilt over Ultron.

 You could dig up Christopher Reeves paraplegic bones and they'd still have more charisma than Caville. That's extremely detrimental, because you need to buy his resurrection is a wonderful moment, and I just don't.

 Hiddleson utterly dwarfs that CGI thing in terms of charismatic villains.
 
Jason Momoa's goofy barbarian is boring shit compared to Hemsworth's goofy barbarian.

Just the whole acting caste feels B-list at best compared to the Avengers. It's a team of Jeremy Renners. Christ, the CW actors have more charisma than this bunch.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 18, 2017, 04:15:15 PM
To their credit (Most likely Joss Whedon) the Superman we get from the point of him showing up for the big fight on is the Superman people want personality-wise.

Agreed though Batman seemed to take a step backwards for me. Overall I liked the heroes more or less (except for the flash just could get into the guy playing him) the story was really badly done and some really bad CGI (Cyborg hurt my eyes) and many points.

I like the Flash but it was because he really wasn't Barry. He was more like Bart.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Rynox on November 18, 2017, 04:56:48 PM
It's a team of Jeremy Renners.

Hahahaha
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 18, 2017, 05:30:27 PM
It's a team of Jeremy Renners.

Bro, harsh
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: LiquidSailor on November 18, 2017, 05:46:32 PM
What plot device did they use to resurrect Superman?  Chicken soup IV?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 18, 2017, 07:00:13 PM
It's a team of Jeremy Renners.

Bro, harsh

Except even Hawkeye has had character building moments.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 18, 2017, 09:17:52 PM
What plot device did they use to resurrect Superman?  Chicken soup IV?

....yeah kinda
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 18, 2017, 10:14:26 PM
I just got back and I really enjoyed it.

It was clearly a turning the corner movie and this felt like Superman's first appearance on film in the modern age. Nailed it in power and personality

Ezra miller was a ham as Flash, but if reigned in he could be good and I think people are being quite harsh. It took Hemsworth a lot of awful films to finally nail the tone of Thor.

Loved the characters, the film felt uneven and the villain was awful which seems to be a serious DC problem but overall it hit the rigth notes to start over
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: INDRA THUNDERER on November 18, 2017, 11:54:19 PM
It took Hemsworth a lot of awful films to finally nail the tone of Thor.


disingenous??smh Hemsworth nailed the tone of Thor from the start,as did Hiddleston with Loki.The only way you wouldn't have enjoyed this film is if Superman wasn't in it!
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 19, 2017, 01:51:01 AM
I just saw it.  It was okay but you could tell they cut a lot out of it.

THE GOOD:

They finally turned Superman into an inspirational hero as Henry Cavill smiled more in this movie than BvS and MoS combined. 

Flash and Aquaman were fun to watch, even if they were under used. 

Gal Gadot was awesome as always as Wonder Woman. 

There was some nice world building going on.

THE BAD:

Batman was oddly useless aside from Clark's resurrection and getting the team together.

The action was typical Zack Snyder fuckery where I wasn't sure where people were in relation to each other and there was just a lot of light and sound.

The thing was only two hours long but felt like it was an hour and a half.  It was insanely rushed.  For instance, there's a scene where the team is hanging off the wall of a sewer, then Cyborg flies off and leaves them, then Cyborg returns at Batman's HQ with a Motherbox somehow, then Batman's like "Hey we can use this to bring back Superman".  Then they do.

They REALLY needed solo movies for Aquaman and Flash at least.  They have two quick scenes with Flash's dad and I didn't care that the dude was in prison because I wasn't introduced to him in any meaningful way. Then there's the scene where Mera and Aquaman discuss Atlantean politics and history and it meant nothing to me.  There was no dramatic punch to any of it.

The Parademons were more interesting than Steppenwolf.  That's how boring Steppenwolf is.

Cyborg should have been a sympathetic character or at least interesting as he had a unique powerset.  He was neither.  He's almost as bland as Steppenwolf.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 19, 2017, 02:29:25 AM
It took Hemsworth a lot of awful films to finally nail the tone of Thor.


disingenous??smh Hemsworth nailed the tone of Thor from the start,as did Hiddleston with Loki.The only way you wouldn't have enjoyed this film is if Superman wasn't in it!

Yeah, Hemsworth and Hiddleston were famous precisely because they played Thor and Loki.  The first two Thor movies weren't the best MCU films but even they were fresh on all the review sites, the fans were mostly positive if lukewarm, and they made their projected gross.  None of the Thor movies got the hate that BvS got.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 19, 2017, 02:30:16 AM
Who okay-ed the Steppenwolf CGI?! - Ouch.

It was fun, felt rushed, but fun and I would see a sequel.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on November 19, 2017, 02:34:17 AM
Hemsworth and Hiddleson basically carry the Thor movies, allowing the audience to ignore flaws because you want to see more of these two guys. The caste of Justice League couldn't carry a feather.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 19, 2017, 02:51:30 AM
Hemsworth and Hiddleson basically carry the Thor movies, allowing the audience to ignore flaws because you want to see more of these two guys. The caste of Justice League couldn't carry a feather.

Yeah, Hemsworth, Hiddleston, the writing, production value, etc...
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: altoon on November 19, 2017, 04:52:06 AM
Who okay-ed the Steppenwolf CGI?! - Ouch.

It was fun, felt rushed, but fun and I would see a sequel.

I have no interest in a sequel with that Luther.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on November 19, 2017, 05:10:26 AM
Hemsworth and Hiddleson basically carry the Thor movies, allowing the audience to ignore flaws because you want to see more of these two guys. The caste of Justice League couldn't carry a feather.

Yeah, Hemsworth, Hiddleston, the writing, production value, etc...

The writing? The first Thor movie was basically Beastmaster 2: Through the Portal of Time. Hemsworth and Hiddleson are just so damned good that you don't care that the writing is Beastmaster 2 with the serial numbers filed off.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 19, 2017, 09:20:31 AM
Just saw it.

Went in with low expectations obviously - overall verdict is that it was OK. The most striking feature of the film is its un-evenness however. And i found myself unable to stop wondering which parts were Whedon and which parts were Snyder and which parts were Snyder trying to make a film that wasn't like Batman vs Superman.

The Good

Superman - In almost every scene this feels basically like Superman and not some random alien with Superman's powers. The difference in his costume is ridiculous also - the Snyder desaturation is gone and so his cape is actually red, the costume actually blue etc. I liked the brief use of the John Williams theme also after he is brought back to life.

AquaBro worked IMO which was surprising cos i've never liked Nu-Aquaman. But Momoa was surprisingly likable and at times comedically capable.

Despite reports about him being boring I thought Cyborg was pretty decent at least as so far as the guy playing him was pretty good.

Jeremy Irons was good - probably the one actor who never comes across as seeming a little bit silly delivering any of his lines.

The Bad

Again the worst thing about the film is that it feels so piecemeal and uneven. Theres a scene between Lois and Martha near the beginning that looks like it was written and shot in about 15 minutes - it could be an outtake from The Office. Stuff like this really sticks out when other parts of the film are visually very slick. Theres a scene with a ton of exposition around the Motherboxes which has an incredibly awkward cut to Bruce and Diana walking around the lake at Wayne Manor - it almost seemed like it was supposed to be a joke of some kind.

Steppenwolf seemed OK to me given how much people hate him but he just feels too insignificant a threat by the final act. It really feels like Superman could have beaten the shit out of him by himself and that it wouldnt really be much of an effort for him either. The fact that a bunch of fucking Parademons take him out at the end doesnt really help when we see Batman handle them at other times.

The final shot of the team looking over ButtFuckalonia smiling while weird alien lifeforms grow is kind of horrendous - and sort of serves as a symbol of how much they havent sold the idea of this group as a team. Batman looks like Lego Batman given how much armor and padding they've shoved in - I doubt Affleck could fully lower his arms at that point.

Superbreath comes out in the final act :-\

Clark Kent's corpse being carried into the Kryptonian Birthing Chamber looked kind of icky, even in long shot.

The Other

Superman is crazily overpowered relative to the rest of the team. Hes basically as fast as The Flash (he seems slower earlier), overpowers Aquaman/WW/Cyborg at the same time etc. Without Superman it would have seemed like a heroic but not insurmountable challenge for the team to beat Steppenwolf - when he shows up its a foregone conclusion.

The Flash is surprisingly fucking useless power-wise. He literally trips over his feet, he gets shot in the leg and is then apparently completely helpless and has to be carried out of battle by someone else.

Power levels in general seemed pretty inconsistent. At one point Barry is falling or something at full superspeed and Batman saves him by catching his leg with a rope.

Character wise Flash is really hit and miss. He had some good moments ("Hi Barry, I'm Diana", exploing the Batcave) but at other times he was just the comic relief guy who would say a line that wasnt funny enough to actually make you laugh.

Batman being a Batdick for the sake of building a team is something that doesnt seem to have worked for many people ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

JK Simmons hardly does anything.

It is striking how much the public perception of Affleck/WW seems to have changed how people reacted to these two. After BvS there was almost universal sentiment that Affleck as Batman was one of the few decent things about the film while a lot of people though Gadot was pretty terrible when she had to talk/act and not fight. I still havent seen WW but i cant say my own opinion of Gadot has changed. Shes not awful here but at times it felt like I was watching some random former model with an accent and 6 months of acting courses Melania Trump their way through the role.



All in all it has a very weird feel which no doubt reflects the fact that it was originally two films with one director before being one film with two directors. The biggest consequence of this might be that it feels less consequential somehow - maybe thats due to the fact that there was hardly any real world hype for the film though, hard to say.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 19, 2017, 09:39:39 AM
Seems like a credible list of who was responsible for which bit:

https://www.resetera.com/threads/community-spotlight-dceu-era-ot-crisis-on-infinite-forums.465/page-130#post-1089110
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Clock on November 19, 2017, 10:49:53 AM
Around $94 million for the weekend it seems to have gotten.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 19, 2017, 12:56:40 PM
That little Watchmen-esque intro to the world losing hope without Superman was so ridiculously ham-fisted. A bunch of shots of buildings and then, suddenly, a neo Nazis kicks orange crates over at a Middle Eastern store, end montage.

Also yes to the comment about the Batsuit looking too bloated.

A great scene was Batman telling Flash, "Save one." - That felt authentic and powerful. Then they kind of dropped the ball on following up with it.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 19, 2017, 01:37:44 PM
This could very well be the end of the DCEU.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Ditto on November 19, 2017, 01:59:53 PM
I genuinely liked it overall though there are an insane amount of gripes. I’d watch a solo film about any of the leaguers from this movie.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 19, 2017, 02:03:34 PM
So would I.  The league themselves were very good in this. 
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Strawman Abridged on November 19, 2017, 02:07:12 PM
Darth going into full Hudson game-over mode? Haha what the hell?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 19, 2017, 02:08:08 PM
I'm a realist.  Don't confuse me with FG or Quan.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Ditto on November 19, 2017, 02:08:45 PM
Steppenwolf was a fucking abomination. My girlfriend had to ask me what he said numerous times. And his cgi was horrendous. Why not make a human actor play the part? It looked so bad.

Almost as bad as the field scene or cavill’s lip.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 19, 2017, 03:38:55 PM
I saw it Saturday and liked it. There were obvious flaws, which have been covered here, but the characters were very well done. Which is what you need for their solo films. The DCEU may pull a "reverse MCU" and have the solo movies be the better of the franchise.

Flash wasn't like comic Barry, at all. He still filled a need though and I liked the characterization. Given his powers, Flash needs to be needed in some way or he ends the film in 3 seconds. Loved him and Cyborg as a friendship. Made me wish he was Wally.

Wonder Woman stole the show for me. She's just awasome and I think Gal and Ben have great chemistry. Her bullet-blocking scene was ridiculous!

Superman had a personality change out of nowhere. Granted, I like this version but it was jarring. Didn't really care for him being so far beyond the other members. Although his scene with Flash saving people was great. Also like his joking with Cyborg.

All in all, I give it 7-7.5/10, which is good but not great. And that's disappointing for what the film should have been.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 19, 2017, 05:48:03 PM
This could very well be the end of the DCEU.

Given the rumours - yeah it could be.

The idea that WB might reverse overall course and try to make a few movies that stand on their own - de-emphasizing the idea of a shared universe and especially a connection to JL would have seemed insane before but apparently thats very much on the table now.

And when you consider that JL turned out to be the "Anti-Avengers" in that its almost certainly going to make less than solo efforts like WW (from just a few months ago), MOS and BvS it does make a certain kind of sense.

In particular, I'm 50/50 on whether we will ever see Cavill as Superman again which is a bit sad given that they finally got him right.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 19, 2017, 05:50:37 PM
Fuck just remembered another minor gripe:

- For like the eighth time in the DCEU, Lois screams out "Clark!!!!!!!!!" at Superman - standing not ten feet from a bunch of ordinary cops. Way to protect that secret identity...
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 19, 2017, 05:51:34 PM
Anyway - estimates are out - 96 million weekend.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/weekend/chart/
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 19, 2017, 06:16:49 PM
This could very well be the end of the DCEU.

Lol no way in hell. DC will keep trying and trying.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 19, 2017, 07:53:30 PM
I hope it gets better but I trust WB management about as much as I do for Quan to concede his pet characters can lose.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 19, 2017, 08:14:02 PM
This could very well be the end of the DCEU.

Lol no way in hell. DC will keep trying and trying.

Eventually, they'll lose enough money that they will have to end it.  They can probably keep afloat for a few more flicks, but it doesn't look good for them.  Both BvS and Justice League were their major tentpole movies and neither one really broke records or anything.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 19, 2017, 09:40:36 PM
I think the mistake is comparing DC to Marvel.

I didnt do that once in my response.

Quote
DC is still making a load of money. Suicide Squad - bad flick with bright spots in certain stand out characters - 850 million.
Wonder Woman - close to 900$, As bad as Superman batman was, its still a near 900 milion dollar film. That's not X Men money

BO numbers today had an enormous return internationally. What we see is that US audiences are demanding change and wny shouldn't they

The foreign BO does not appear to be enormous relative to the US.

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I'm a little suprised that anyone thought this film would be anything other than lukewarm to good. Audience scores on RT were a solid B+.  Critics are getting a litle power hungry in how savage they're being with films. I get that the film isn't perfect, but lower than 40% is vindictive - although I don't know what the score is now

If people like the indivudal characters enough to follow the stand alones coming up while Flash Flashpoint can retcon things that don't work the film has done its job. Audiences are sophisticated - if DC clearly shifted its tone, Snyder is gone, and peoplle start hearing the right announcements the die-hard DC fans will come out - the real question will be casual moviegoers and the occasional Marvel die-hard

Of course the DC die-hards are going to come out. You cant rely on them to carry a mid budget film let alone a tentpole like JL. Modern superhero movies are not art house films that general movie goers avoid - they rely on pulling in the vast bulk of audiences to make any money.

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IMHO DC will regain the casual moviegoers and with effort, marvelites will join up partially. There's good stuff coming up

Aquaman, WW, Shazam future MOS and a new Batman plus Nightwing, and other potential projects are all potentially fantastic. hell, who would have thought Aquaman would have been reimagined and gotten a direvto rlike James Wan

This all feels very inevitable to me and its not as bad as I imagined. 83 millio today - 119 total and its Saturday afternoon. Global could end up at 200 million

Well it didn't but that seems like the least important point...

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I never thought DC had a chance against  THir comedy with Loki, Hulk and other Marvel superstars init. Marvel as of current has so many stars that every solo film with a team up is a de facto JL.

To suggest that people never thought Justice League had a chance against the third Thor film is insane revisionism.

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DC not getting the same BO isn't bad as long as the films make money - and they are, and the films are moving in a pisitive direction that fans will look forward to. Eventually they will have built up the goodwill that several years of a shared universe rbrings.

Everything disagrees with you here. The movies are moving in the wrong direction from a Box Office perspective. Nobody, and i use the term relatively, was really looking forward to this.

4 years ago people were saying the same thing about what a great place we would be in by the time JL hits so the idea that "Eventually they will have built up the goodwill that several years of a shared universe brings" is hardly justified. Making a bunch of movies and shoving them in peoples faces for years doesnt automatically generate goodwill. In this case, as in many, just the opposite in fact.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: INDRA THUNDERER on November 19, 2017, 11:05:11 PM
Everything FifthChild wrote is truth!Lois,& fucking BATMAN calling him "Clark" in front of the police?the CGI for Superman's mouth,Steppenwolf,wtf?,& the only one who seemed threatened by anything was Bruce!Flash's characterization was great,he's no Barry or Wally,but likeable.WW needed better lines,as she was the only standout,imo.Superman's re-introduction to the fight was LAME!He should've decked Steppenwolf ,then let out the cornball exposition.it would've felt like the cavalry had arrived,but instead fell flat imo.Snyder sucks!
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 20, 2017, 12:15:58 AM
Everything FifthChild wrote is truth!Lois,& fucking BATMAN calling him "Clark" in front of the police?the CGI for Superman's mouth,Steppenwolf,wtf?,& the only one who seemed threatened by anything was Bruce!Flash's characterization was great,he's no Barry or Wally,but likeable.WW needed better lines,as she was the only standout,imo.Superman's re-introduction to the fight was LAME!He should've decked Steppenwolf ,then let out the cornball exposition.it would've felt like the cavalry had arrived,but instead fell flat imo.Snyder sucks!

Batman doesn't seem to care about his own identity.  The first thing he does when meeting Aquaman and Flash is reveal his identity in hopes that they will become allies.  Hell, him and Aquaman have a nice chat about how he's Batman, right there in front of random villagers.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 20, 2017, 03:48:43 AM
This could very well be the end of the DCEU.

Lol no way in hell. DC will keep trying and trying.

Eventually, they'll lose enough money that they will have to end it.  They can probably keep afloat for a few more flicks, but it doesn't look good for them.  Both BvS and Justice League were their major tentpole movies and neither one really broke records or anything.

Lose money? How? Batman vs Superman nearly tripled it's gross budget in worldwide sales. Are they matching up with Marvel benchmarks? No. But the movies are still profitable at the end of the day.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 20, 2017, 03:52:05 AM
This could very well be the end of the DCEU.

Lol no way in hell. DC will keep trying and trying.

Eventually, they'll lose enough money that they will have to end it.  They can probably keep afloat for a few more flicks, but it doesn't look good for them.  Both BvS and Justice League were their major tentpole movies and neither one really broke records or anything.

Lose money? How? Batman vs Superman nearly tripled it's gross budget in worldwide sales. Are they matching up with Marvel benchmarks? No. But the movies are still profitable at the end of the day.

They're not making their projected numbers.  Also, each movie has made less than the last.  Eventually they will start losing money.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: pittfox on November 20, 2017, 06:44:24 AM
 Unlike most who say they liked it but had major issues, I disliked it but had some this I really liked about this. A let down.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 20, 2017, 07:00:25 AM
Lose money? How? Batman vs Superman nearly tripled it's gross budget in worldwide sales. Are they matching up with Marvel benchmarks? No. But the movies are still profitable at the end of the day.

They're not making their projected numbers.  Also, each movie has made less than the last.  Eventually they will start losing money.

JL could well lose money - apparently it needs about 700 to 750 million WW to break even. Thats going to be tough.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 20, 2017, 08:50:35 AM
Justice Leagues film budget was 300 million. I highly doubt they spent another 400 million promoting the movie. That's just ridiculous. The movies all make money. Just not as much as they hoped.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 20, 2017, 12:25:30 PM
Studios dont get anywhere close to the entire Box Office receipts. Its complicated but roughly half goes to the theatres screening the film (less towards the beginning of its run - more towards the end). Then you might have shit like participants who negotiated gross percentage points (they get paid a percentage of total profits) - this is how RDJ made $50 million from Avengers.

Studios play this stuff pretty close to their vests but a decent rule of thumb is that a film has to make twice its budget back at the BO before it becomes profitable. That rule tends to bear out IMO also because if a film stalls out around that point studios usually think long and hard about whether to make a sequel.

Take it with a grain of salt given that theirs a fair bit of guesstimation but heres a fairly credible breakdown of how much money Batman v Superman would have made for WB for example:

http://deadline.com/2017/03/batman-v-superman-box-office-profit-2016-1202049201/
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 20, 2017, 12:28:00 PM
3/4 DCEU's films left the general audience "gun shy" about them. So a lot of people are either waiting on WoM or have just decided to watch it when it home releases. It's sad because this was actually a pretty enjoyable film and definitely a move in the right direction for the DCEU going forward. I doubt they'll scap the whole thing, though. Likely they will focus on the solo films for now and wait a minute before JL 2.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 20, 2017, 12:49:30 PM
Hollywood Reporter is reporting an opening of $94 million which puts in below Winter Soldier and on par with the first Guardians for opening weekends. 

A huge disaster for WB/DC and they have themselves to blame.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 20, 2017, 01:28:09 PM
Yeah. If you adjust for inflation the Ang Lee Hulk film had a 92 million opening weekend if you can believe it.

WB are in a really weird spot in that WW is a big success but the Snyder Batman/Superman connections seem to be toxic with audiences. Like if everything was fucked you might scrap it all, wait a few years and start again - if comic book films still seemed like a smart bet at that point.

Anyway i think there will be some very interesting stories to come out of this years down the line when people feel able to to speak freely about everything. I dont think it will be as simple as "It was all Snyder's fault" either.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: altoon on November 20, 2017, 01:44:38 PM
I think it all gonna be put on Snyder and there gonna move forward without him or his style in all future movies.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 20, 2017, 01:49:55 PM
At a 282$ million global box office Justice League is on pace to make around 800$million. Keep in mind, the release was the week BEFORE Thanksgiving and there could be a large contingent of people traveling. I expect the follow up weekend to be strong.

Second factor and what I consider to be the real risk: Pirates of the Caribbean, Fast and the Furious, and Transformers are all getting higher foreign box office returns and dwindling domestic returns, They're still hitting the 1 billion dollar mark frequently on spectactle. If Warner keeps making money, and make no mistake; after you factor in blu-ray, netflix, and all other forms of income, this will be a profitable movie, they don't have much reason to change.

Creatively this was clearly a pivot, Superman's characterization alone signaled that, but Warner is missing a key component. Disney and Marvel have Kathleen Kennedy and Kevin Feige to provide consistency and who have firing auhority. Warrer has a habit of hiring great talent in casting then letting directors with awful track records make clossal mistkes and on top of that make bad creative decisions when the suits enter in.

DDC clearly needs a central figure to maintain a DC feel.

The loyalty to figures like David Ayer, whose record is spotty at best, are not helpfu Throw in your Zach Snyder's and other assorted mistakes and you have a universe that resonates on some levels, bit never fires on all cylinders

Nevertheless I saw this movie as a clear signal that they are getting the message and if course correction continues great things can happen. DC isn't Marvel, they can't be and their source material isn't prone to the same kind of direction. DC really needs its Feige or Kenedy to stay the creative course and to keep the things that have worked very well so far and trash what hasn't (Zukcerberg, Amy Adams, most of Suicide Squad,)

I would also advise against a hard Spider-Man like reboot. Even the amazing Spider-man Homecoing took a while to find its legs after too many reboots

If DC throws out the trash and keeps fan favorties (Cavill Superman, Battfleck, Miller Flash, Mamoa, WW, Harley) then the universe can be built accordingly and rebots can be discrete.

Will anyone cvare of Luthor is suddenly replaced by his hidden "real father" played by Mark Strong or Billy Zane?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Ditto on November 20, 2017, 03:32:39 PM
Jesus Christ safado, this movie was a financial dumpster fire. Just stop trying to spin it. Even if there’s no significant drop-off (how often does that happen?), this movie is still severely underperforming. And it’s a TEAM movie. It’s pathetic. Fuck WB is the only thing you should be harping on about.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: LiquidSailor on November 20, 2017, 03:39:25 PM
Cavill Superman is a fan favorite?  You delusional BR faggot.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Ditto on November 20, 2017, 03:42:04 PM
Every single person I know, including DC try-hards and apologists, has hated Superman because he made the entire team irrelevant.

I liked his personality but also agree that him casually outperforming everyone at the end was ridiculous and off-putting. I’m surprised they didn’t have him hacking the motherboxes too.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 20, 2017, 05:18:04 PM
Every single person I know, including DC try-hards and apologists, has hated Superman because he made the entire team irrelevant.

I liked his personality but also agree that him casually outperforming everyone at the end was ridiculous and off-putting. I’m surprised they didn’t have him hacking the motherboxes too.

Yeah, the LEague was pretty much pointless.  They should have just brought Supes back and gone home since they couldn't do anything without him.

I did like Cavil's Superman better in this in that the guy actually smiled and seemed to care about shit.  I bet Snyder's original vision would've had Superman come back and kick everyone's asses because they pissed him off, then flown to Russia or wherever and nuked the entire place, giving one last look of contempt at the burning crater before flying to Kansas to complain to his mom that he's too good for this Earth.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Insane Titan on November 20, 2017, 05:19:08 PM
Hollywood Reporter is reporting an opening of $94 million which puts in below Winter Soldier and on par with the first Guardians for opening weekends. 

A huge disaster for WB/DC and they have themselves to blame.
Are you ok?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: superlurker on November 20, 2017, 05:31:33 PM
I liked his personality but also agree that him casually outperforming everyone at the end was ridiculous and off-putting. I’m surprised they didn’t have him hacking the motherboxes too.

Well, it looked like Cyborg would have failed without Superman to actually pull the boxes apart, so he sort of helped with the "hacking" part too.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 20, 2017, 05:34:24 PM
I'm just fine. Go check on FG. Poor lady is having meltdowns in several threads.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 20, 2017, 06:53:29 PM
You're not looking at it from the studio's perspective

All Marvel films are team films now - Hulk has been in 5 movies? Thor has had 3 solo and two team flicks.

All you need to do is have any one of the main hero's have a solo flick after 10 years of correct universe building and then have any of the other 800 millon per solo outing superstars co-star and throw in some minor cameos or a smattering of Marvel characters and you have a team flick. People will pay extra for Avengers because the characters they know and love have spent TEN years waiting for one threat and fans want to see how it plays out. I'm pretty sure Marvel will eventually hit a 2 billion flick

Having said that

Movies that are in the 700-900 million dollar mark before streaming and blu-ray ARE profitable. Not AS profitable as they could be nor as profitable as Marvel, ut the only other company that is as profitable as marvel are their teammates at Disney.

As much as DC is under performing remember that not that long ago Fantastic Four was an enormous franchise beloved by many and seeing Dr Doom or Galactus on screen was like waiting for Darth Vader to reappear. How'd that work out so far? If Marvel flat out buys the rights to Fox owned properties, we'l see it come back for real but at present does FF even have a comic title?

Transformers is awful but somehow its got several billion dollar entries. No one will ever accuse it of being good - but it is profitable.

DC can either learn the right lessons with the underwhelming domestic reception it got, as it likely will make it to around 800 million and turn a profit; or it can be oe of those awful franchises that makes money entirely on foreign box office and slowly dies off. I think spectacle can go very far, but it's a little early to say that DC is dead

In a movie that had two directors with one dropping out due to a family suicide, a sex scandal starring one of the leads, a lead who has been rumored to be on the chopping block for months (Affleck again) and sveral million dollars lost due to Cavill's porn star stache - who was expecting a great movie?

At my theater audiences flipped when Cavill had his best moments. They also laughed at a lot of lines that were meant to hit home even while some of the lines fell flat.

Batman is hard to write in the JLA because his role is tactician deus ex machina and he looked as underpowered as he is here.

The story is that the candle of hope has flickered out after Superman has died, inviting Steppenwolf to attempt to escape exile because earth is vulnerable again. He's a completely generic Macguffin meant to drive the team together with the caveat tat they don't have the firepower to do it and their only hope is to nring their hope and power back and save the day.

Hopelessly generic but if Superman comes back after that and he's mediocre or somber then the story loses it's meaning, however generic it is. The characters can be fleshed out in individual flicks - they're all rookies except for WW and Batman.

By the lighter portrayal, strong characterization and direction the film took, including the Danny Elfman score, it looks like WB is trying to pivot. It was a hopeless task but I saw an opportunity to improve and a franchise that's at the very least self-aware that it has problems.

Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 20, 2017, 07:03:01 PM
remember that not that long ago Fantastic Four was an enormous franchise beloved by many and seeing Dr Doom or Galactus on screen was like waiting for Darth Vader to reappear. How'd that work out so far? If Marvel flat out buys the rights to Fox owned properties, we'l see it come back for real but at present does FF even have a comic title?

None of the Fantastic Four movies did very well with critics or fans.  The first one made enough money for a sequel but aside form that, there have been multiple failures.  Hell, the VERY first FF movie wasn't even released and is only available on bootleg.  How is that in any way comparable?

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Transformers is awful but somehow its got several billion dollar entries. No one will ever accuse it of being good - but it is profitable.

True, but every TF movie has made a shit ton of money.  Like record-breaking amounts of money, mostly coming from Chinese audiences who, for whatever reason, really love seeing giant robots punch each other.  None of the DC movies have made that much money.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: altoon on November 20, 2017, 09:47:54 PM
Damn it made less than what was thought a little under 94 mill.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 20, 2017, 10:53:40 PM
At a 282$ million global box office Justice League is on pace to make around 800$million.

No it isnt. Actuals are being revised down from estimates because it is already showing signs of poor legs.

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Keep in mind, the release was the week BEFORE Thanksgiving and there could be a large contingent of people traveling. I expect the follow up weekend to be strong.

I dont expect it to be terrible, mostly because of the fact that bigger openings are prone to fall harder, even with well-liked films, purely because of saturation. But i dont expect this to hang around - if nothing else its now being caught up in a ton of negative publicity around its soft opening weekend.

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Second factor and what I consider to be the real risk: Pirates of the Caribbean, Fast and the Furious, and Transformers are all getting higher foreign box office returns and dwindling domestic returns, They're still hitting the 1 billion dollar mark frequently on spectactle.

The last Transformers film barely cracked 600 million WW. The last Pirates couldn't do 800 million.  These are franchises in decline - both domestically and overseas.

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If Warner keeps making money, and make no mistake; after you factor in blu-ray, netflix, and all other forms of income, this will be a profitable movie, they don't have much reason to change.

1 Its far from clear at this point that this will be a profitable film.
2 The idea that the people at WB are sitting around the office today saying "Hey - if it ain't broke...." is absurd.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Strawman Abridged on November 21, 2017, 12:21:23 AM
Hope remains in these guys.


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DI-CA0OUwAAaoii.jpg)

(http://download.gamezone.com/uploads/image/data/1212416/article_post_width_the-rock-black-adam.jpg)


Fuck those Justice League losers
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 21, 2017, 12:42:51 AM
What's going on in Waner is pivotal - they are suits. As bad as the actual film Suicide Squad all they saw was te bottom line, the best costume awards, and the Harely Quinn outfit at Halloween and asked David Ayer back to make another dumpster fire.

Transformers and POC might not be at the top of their game - but those are still special efects spectacles trotted out to make well over 800 million to a billion. Fast and Fiurious barely made 250 domestically but took in a billion worldwiide.

I'm not saying thats a good thing mind you - I'm simply saying that Warner had better pay attention or the frachise will stay moderately good enough to possibly satisfy die hard fans, squeee out the occasional pearl and stay where its at if nothing is done in creative and getting control. A Kennedy o rFeige is sorely sorely needed

As for the doomsday prophets - if a month goes by and the film has done nothing, I will admit I'm wrong

As of right now - let's assume a 60% drop - typical for a lot of franchises. That woukd make it about 40 million to maybe a bit more. It's still Thanksgiving weekend so let's assume it might do a little better, say about 50%, that brings hhte film to around 135 million domestic with another 4 weeks with no competition at all until Star Wars.

Thats one month with a long holiday weekend that there is no competition at all for a big superhero tentpole that got a B_+ audience score

It's also a film that is scoring very very well in international markets and still has many weeks and other counties to roll ou tin.

If inernational comes in at even half-ish with the same for domestic that 281 goes to 320-330 after a week - maybe a little more after a long weekend Then it has a few weeks to struggle up to the 800 mark or so, which it likely can. There's no strong film against it and even after Star Wars it might hang around long enough to keep squeezing out extra showings here and there.
800 million is mathematically not that far off.

Considering its up to around 40 million in China and will likely make it to 120 million there while some countries havent been rolled out - if it makes 250 domestic it can certainly make up the rest abroad

As for the FF movies - kind of proves my point

They are sterling franchises with decades of rich storylines, die hard fans,mythology and a previously flourishing creative team at Marvel

In two attempts at starting a franchise Dr Doom was sullied as a character and the films were "deconstructed." I saw the second FF series in no joke an empty theater. I didn't think that was possible.

My point is - yes, DC is underperforming but there are enough bright points to have hope that it can be turned around and fans who ar excited about certain characters and ideas. Its not Marvel, Marvel is in Disney territory for now in terms of size, scope and unstoppable efficiency - but DC is still ahead of the X men, Fantastic Four, Marvels forgotten projects (Inhumans anyone Shield, Ghost Rider)

After the first 2 X Men films how long until we really saw quality again and even then, it was generally pilloried as spotty and mixed despite moments of brilliance.

I REALLY hope Warner learns from this - the next film will be a James Wan vehicle and I trust James Wan creatively and as a businessman, Birds of Prey will print money if it has an even vaguely coherent script, WW, Superman, Flash, and even Green Lantern generate a lot of excitement for their upcoming solo flicks and Matt Reeve did a great job in the conclusion to Planet of the Apes and hell be doin ng the solo Batman no matter which actor takes the lead

There's plenty to be excited about but Warner really has to make the pivot and do it correctly - I do think they see the risks and they are shaken up enough to feel the need to do so.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 21, 2017, 03:44:32 AM
Studios dont get anywhere close to the entire Box Office receipts. Its complicated but roughly half goes to the theatres screening the film (less towards the beginning of its run - more towards the end). Then you might have shit like participants who negotiated gross percentage points (they get paid a percentage of total profits) - this is how RDJ made $50 million from Avengers.

Studios play this stuff pretty close to their vests but a decent rule of thumb is that a film has to make twice its budget back at the BO before it becomes profitable. That rule tends to bear out IMO also because if a film stalls out around that point studios usually think long and hard about whether to make a sequel.

Take it with a grain of salt given that theirs a fair bit of guesstimation but heres a fairly credible breakdown of how much money Batman v Superman would have made for WB for example:

http://deadline.com/2017/03/batman-v-superman-box-office-profit-2016-1202049201/

Im aware. And again, BVS nearly tripled it's budget in box office receipts worldwide. And that doesn't count any of the other revenue streams studios get a piece of when the movies leave theaters. The movies are profitable. Just not overly so.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on November 21, 2017, 04:48:57 AM
I'm not sure what the hell is being PRd here.

https://www.polygon.com/2017/11/20/16679328/justice-league-box-office-opening-weekend

It looks like word of mouth has started to kill this movie at the BO. As the writer mentioned, the 2nd week will see if the BO recipients manages to eke out the required amount to consider a hit HOWEVER, the 2nd week is the usual determiner if the movie will go on to succeed or fail. If word of mouth keeps spreading how JL is Suicide Squad II, then WB may as well revamp the entire DCEU and reboot everything from scratch.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on November 21, 2017, 04:51:01 AM
P.S. Suck Snyder killed this DCEU since Man of Steel. The writing on the wall should have been clear as halogen lamps on a stormy night.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 21, 2017, 08:15:32 AM
What's going on in Waner is pivotal - they are suits. As bad as the actual film Suicide Squad all they saw was te bottom line, the best costume awards, and the Harely Quinn outfit at Halloween and asked David Ayer back to make another dumpster fire.

Completely false. They were already spooked by the reactions to BvS/MoS and had heavily fucked with Ayer during production and post on Suicide Squad - which completely belies your idea that WB was like "everythings cool" because "all they saw was the bottom line". And post SS they were further motivated to fuck with JL.

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Transformers and POC might not be at the top of their game - but those are still special efects spectacles trotted out to make well over 800 million to a billion. Fast and Fiurious barely made 250 domestically but took in a billion worldwiide.

Its stupid to compare the FF franchise which is probably the biggest and most reliable in the world right now outside of Marvel with Pirates and Transformers.

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I'm not saying thats a good thing mind you - I'm simply saying that Warner had better pay attention or the frachise will stay moderately good enough to possibly satisfy die hard fans, squeee out the occasional pearl and stay where its at if nothing is done in creative and getting control. A Kennedy o rFeige is sorely sorely needed

Stay where it is? A movie with Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman opened to less than a film with Superman & Batman, less money than a film with only Superman and less money than a film with only Wonder Woman. The implications of this are pretty clear - WB has significantly dampened interest in these films. This film is pretty clearly not going to reverse or even halt that trend. In short - at this point a Justice League 2 would open to even smaller numbers.

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As for the doomsday prophets - if a month goes by and the film has done nothing, I will admit I'm wrong

As of right now - let's assume a 60% drop - typical for a lot of franchises. That woukd make it about 40 million to maybe a bit more. It's still Thanksgiving weekend so let's assume it might do a little better, say about 50%, that brings hhte film to around 135 million domestic with another 4 weeks with no competition at all until Star Wars.

Thats one month with a long holiday weekend that there is no competition at all for a big superhero tentpole that got a B_+ audience score

Its not going to sit there like a sponge sucking in money. It will lose screens. It has bad buzz and aforementioned publicity problems from the fact that people know it is underperforming. The idea that it might have good legs seems unlikely given that its already showing signs of being frontloaded.

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It's also a film that is scoring very very well in international markets and still has many weeks and other counties to roll ou tin.

The only notable market it hasnt been released in yet is Japan. And its not doing spectacularly overseas either - good in some places, not so great in others.

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If inernational comes in at even half-ish with the same for domestic that 281 goes to 320-330 after a week - maybe a little more after a long weekend Then it has a few weeks to struggle up to the 800 mark or so, which it likely can. There's no strong film against it and even after Star Wars it might hang around long enough to keep squeezing out extra showings here and there.
800 million is mathematically not that far off.

Considering its up to around 40 million in China and will likely make it to 120 million there while some countries havent been rolled out - if it makes 250 domestic it can certainly make up the rest abroad

Its trailing BvS in China which topped out at $96 million - why would this make $120? If it has similar legs it will make about $86 million.

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My point is - yes, DC is underperforming but there are enough bright points to have hope that it can be turned around and fans who ar excited about certain characters and ideas. Its not Marvel, Marvel is in Disney territory for now in terms of size, scope and unstoppable efficiency - but DC is still ahead of the X men, Fantastic Four, Marvels forgotten projects (Inhumans anyone Shield, Ghost Rider)

Theres one bright point so far - Wonder Woman. I'm not sure what being ahead of Fantastic Four, Inhumans or Ghost Rider is supposed to show.

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After the first 2 X Men films how long until we really saw quality again and even then, it was generally pilloried as spotty and mixed despite moments of brilliance.

And you should learn that lesson well. Fox burnt through their audience good will with X3 and Wolverin Origins. They then made 2 solid to very well liked movies before they had built the brand back up again until they could have a hit (Days of Future Past). When you fuck a franchise enough people are slow to come back even when you make a really good movie again (i.e. Batman Begins after Schumaker).

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I REALLY hope Warner learns from this - the next film will be a James Wan vehicle and I trust James Wan creatively and as a businessman, Birds of Prey will print money if it has an even vaguely coherent script, WW, Superman, Flash, and even Green Lantern generate a lot of excitement for their upcoming solo flicks and Matt Reeve did a great job in the conclusion to Planet of the Apes and hell be doin ng the solo Batman no matter which actor takes the lead

There's plenty to be excited about but Warner really has to make the pivot and do it correctly - I do think they see the risks and they are shaken up enough to feel the need to do so.

You are assuming half this shit actually gets made and ignoring the obvious pivot to WB just not making most of them in the first place.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Hamburglar on November 21, 2017, 08:25:11 AM
Yo this movie made less in the opening weekend than fucking Iron Man did ten years ago. AND Iron Man was a nobody!!!!

Rofl rofl!! Which one of you gaylord faggot gals are defending this trash? The typical DC morons? The faggot in the favela and the faggot in the Ganges
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on November 21, 2017, 08:26:19 AM
How do you fuck up a movie with Batman and Superman in it? Somehow DC did it twice. That's almost impressive in a weird sort of way. That takes work.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: LiquidSailor on November 21, 2017, 09:15:37 AM
Brazil needs to be wiped off the map along with Israel.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: -K-M- on November 21, 2017, 09:36:10 AM
Going on Wednesday. Odd people are wanting it to fail and bashing the movie without even seeing it

I disliked BvS so if it’s the same caliber or quality of that then the hate is justified



Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 21, 2017, 10:31:30 AM
I disliked BvS so if it’s the same caliber or quality of that then the hate is justified

It's nowhere near as bad as BvS. It's actually a good movie. Just not what it could have been and disappointing, considering the characters we're talking about. Still, it is entertaining and the characterization/interactions are great. You should enjoy it but it won't blow you away.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 21, 2017, 06:16:58 PM
Internet hate will always be around.

The movie is better than BvS and has some moments.  I think if this movie followed on the heels of more successful films, it would have been more forgivable.  Now, it just comes off as another dud.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 21, 2017, 09:07:53 PM
saw it. It was actully really good. Think the only reason it didnt hit the magical 130 is because of past movie..people assuming its bad

But really like it.  Superman was awesome. The superman and wanted to see

like when Flash was speeding around and his shocked that he could see him
all the character were fun and had great moments. WW againn was the MVP

The villan was weak...needed someone stronger
Probally should of been longer. WB need to either control their directors earlier...or just stop these last second changes

But really looking forward to the aquaman movie. Was worried how the underwater scenes would look but it looked good

The ending scene makes me really hope they dont reboot anything.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 22, 2017, 01:39:39 AM
http://comicbook.com/dc/2017/11/21/justice-league-warner-bros-losses-projections-estimates/
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 22, 2017, 01:47:31 AM
http://comicbook.com/dc/2017/11/21/justice-league-warner-bros-losses-projections-estimates/

Holy shit!  It's really sad to see, actually.  Movies with Superman and Batman in them should be epic.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 22, 2017, 01:54:19 AM
this thing cost 600 million

if that true...even with marketing cost that insane

And I like the movie. They much have an entire movie worth of footage they cut. That damm mustage didnt cost that much
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 22, 2017, 02:37:30 AM
this thing cost 600 million

if that true...even with marketing cost that insane

And I like the movie. They much have an entire movie worth of footage they cut. That damm mustage didnt cost that much

They used CGI to cover Henry Cavil’s upper lip.  They really did not budget well.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 22, 2017, 02:59:44 AM
this thing cost 600 million

if that true...even with marketing cost that insane

And I like the movie. They much have an entire movie worth of footage they cut. That damm mustage didnt cost that much

They used CGI to cover Henry Cavil’s upper lip.  They really did not budget well.

The mustage I somewhat get for continuty reasons since they probally shot some scenes with him not having a musage. Then again some set photos he had a black suit and full beard so who know how much movie they didn't show

Even with factoring in marketing..really doubt marketing 300 dollars, unless they work on tecenlogy to advertise in our dreams

wonder how much this is exaggeration. Know they were saying Sucide Squad needed to make 700 million to break even at a time...which seem dumb. How much did they expect that movie to make..with only a sprinkle of batman and Joker.

Which also make me wonder how much money do these big budget movies make actully. Seem like movies going to make most there money off mercedise these days
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 22, 2017, 03:03:15 AM
also the article said batman v superman made 1 billion in mercendise

who the fuck buying those toys. Got a lot of kids in my area. Dont see that many toy bat mobils let along Batman V superman. Dont kids play video game mostly
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Gree on November 22, 2017, 07:13:05 AM
Moustache
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 22, 2017, 07:23:06 AM
At first, I honestly thought it was something about a Mustang.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 22, 2017, 07:36:40 AM
this thing cost 600 million

if that true...even with marketing cost that insane

And I like the movie. They much have an entire movie worth of footage they cut. That damm mustage didnt cost that much

They used CGI to cover Henry Cavil’s upper lip.  They really did not budget well.

The mustage I somewhat get for continuty reasons since they probally shot some scenes with him not having a musage. Then again some set photos he had a black suit and full beard so who know how much movie they didn't show

Even with factoring in marketing..really doubt marketing 300 dollars, unless they work on tecenlogy to advertise in our dreams

wonder how much this is exaggeration. Know they were saying Sucide Squad needed to make 700 million to break even at a time...which seem dumb. How much did they expect that movie to make..with only a sprinkle of batman and Joker.

They didnt say marketing costs $300 million - they said $150 million for marketing - the rest of the costs is for other stuff.

also the article said batman v superman made 1 billion in mercendise

who the fuck buying those toys. Got a lot of kids in my area. Dont see that many toy bat mobils let along Batman V superman. Dont kids play video game mostly

The actual article doesnt say that money is for "Batman v Superman" merchandise - its for Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman merchandise in general.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 22, 2017, 08:14:06 AM
Why the hell did WB spend so much on this film? Marvel rarely goes over $150 million for their budgets, which helps the profit margin.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 22, 2017, 09:11:52 AM
Why the hell did WB spend so much on this film? Marvel rarely goes over $150 million for their budgets, which helps the profit margin.

WB has traditionally been pretty bad at keeping budgets down on these movies (they spent 200 million on Green Lantern) and Marvel has been notoriously frugal so that probably skews perceptions. Fox are/have been outright cheapskates - as was mocked in Deadpool.

This was also a film that changed a lot over time - originally it was 2 films (with a combined budget said to be $500 million), there were a ton of reshoots and a lot of footage with completed/semi-completed CGI that wasnt used. Theres also the fact that a JL/Avengers style movie was traditionally thought to be impossible from a budgetary perspective - Marvel has shown that this sort of thing is possible but it probably obscures how difficult it is to keep costs under control.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Ditto on November 22, 2017, 11:01:49 AM
Wonder how much they would have saved subbing a human for the horrible cgi villain?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: -K-M- on November 22, 2017, 11:14:19 AM
Going to see it tonight. Dun dun dunnnn
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: MTL76 on November 22, 2017, 12:16:17 PM
I’m not seeing this in theaters. I won’t get fooled again!
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Accel on November 22, 2017, 12:43:20 PM
I enjoyed, like, the first 2/3 of the film, I’d say.  The final act is pretty terrible though, save for a few fun moments with Superman actually being light-hearted for a change; otherwise, it was just such a huge CGI mess that I kept having trouble seeing what was going on in front of me. 

Just a few other thoughts:

Not only did Stepphenwolf’s not do much beyond 'generic bad guy seeking power,'  but he didn’t even feel as threatening as Zod, Doomsday, or even fucking Enchantress to warrant him being the guy who brings the Justice League together.

Did it seem strangely easy how they were able to just… dig up Superman’s grave? Like, apparently this world-renowned, super-powerful space alien was just buried in some random graveyard that two dudes could seemingly walk into and dig him up just like that.

I like how Barry was portrayed, though sometimes his whole “bug-eyed awkwardly look around the room” thing was seriously overdone.  I liked how he was clearly scared of what he was facing and he wasn’t used to actually fighting, so it kind of worked for me why he couldn’t just handle most of the problems right away, which is usually a pet-peeve of mine when it comes to super-speedsters on teams.

Also Flash’s running form is really weird. I just needed to point that out.

It also seemed weird how they didn’t seem to write anything for Aquaman to do regarding water or marine life in the final act, so all he can do is just jump around and punch things hard, like everyone else.  I kept expecting the “Do you really talk to fish?” to come back into play, and it just… doesn’t.

The mid-credits scene was fun.  Batman convincing Flash to just “save one” was a nice touch as well.  In fact, a lot of the little character moments were genuinely good. Hell, Superman here in general was a HUGE step-up from his BvS days.  If we could just get more fun character moments like these and less messiah allegories, I’d be all for this universe.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 22, 2017, 12:53:01 PM
There was two graves. There is a fake grave for Superman without a body in it and a real grave for Clark that had the body. So they didn't different up Superman's grave. They dug up Clark Kent's.

Of course this raises so many questions. Especially if they try and reistablish Clark as alive.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 22, 2017, 01:17:06 PM
Wonder how much they would have saved subbing a human for the horrible cgi villain?

I dont know how you do a big ass space demons like that without some CGI

Kind of like the Hulk..something you have to do. Pretty sure most of the infinity war bad guys will be that by some of the figures they made for concept. But dont know if it going to cost 600 millon dollars. fuck dont think even the star wars movies costing that much and they got money to burn

Cant help but think of this budget stuff exgarrated unless they shot an entire differnet movie, scrap it and shot it again. At that point I dont even blame synder. I would be like "You asshole saw a the dallys, why not do the change when I was 10 percent in or at script stage".

DC really issue is they seem to freak out to much and want to scrap things.  Which kind of made the suicide a dr jekyl and mr Hyde movie.  Apparenty same with this. Harely was popular so...multiple movies with Harley..which would make her over expose. Harley doesnt need her own movie.
Now they want a flash point reboot. Which is a disasterious idea and wound confuse casual fans

or least reign in their people trash talking each other on set

The smart move is to go...fans seem to like the direction.  They like the lighter tone, just stick with that and control the budget better where you wont have rumors that fucking suicide squad needs to make 700 to break even. And maybe scrap that Joker orgin movie
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on November 22, 2017, 01:25:07 PM
Is that Suicide Squad thing serious? It doesn't seem like Suicide Squad would cost much more than Deadpool.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 22, 2017, 01:39:24 PM
There was two graves. There is a fake grave for Superman without a body in it and a real grave for Clark that had the body. So they didn't different up Superman's grave. They dug up Clark Kent's.

Of course this raises so many questions. Especially if they try and reistablish Clark as alive.

Clark also had an open casket funeral, so there were going to be problems no matter what.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Master on November 22, 2017, 02:12:43 PM
They just say Clark went into deep witness protection and faked his own death due to being a witness for a mob trial and- OH HEY, SUPERMAN IS ALIVE AGAIN TOO? WHAT A COOINCIDENCE!!!
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 22, 2017, 02:24:27 PM
How they explain it in superman returns
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 22, 2017, 02:28:39 PM
How they explain it in superman returns

Clark was on a leave of absence prior to flying off into space.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: superlurker on November 22, 2017, 04:32:57 PM
He just shows up for work and acts like nothing. If anyone asks questions, he just lowers his glasses a bit, his eyes start glowing, and the guy who asks starts getting uncomfortably warm.

That's how the glasses disguise works too. Everyone who works at the Daily Planet live every day in constant mortal fear of accidentally stating the obvious.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 22, 2017, 05:09:06 PM
He just shows up for work and acts like nothing. If anyone asks questions, he just lowers his glasses a bit, his eyes start glowing, and the guy who asks starts getting uncomfortably warm.

That's how the glasses disguise works too. Everyone who works at the Daily Planet live every day in constant mortal fear of accidentally stating the obvious.

Wasn't that an SNL skit?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 22, 2017, 05:13:38 PM
Wonder how much they would have saved subbing a human for the horrible cgi villain?

Yeah, they didn't have to make Steppenwolf an 8 foot tall giant.  Just slap some makeup and armor on an actor and use trick photography to make him appear taller than everyone, but not freakishly so.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 22, 2017, 05:20:38 PM
He just shows up for work and acts like nothing. If anyone asks questions, he just lowers his glasses a bit, his eyes start glowing, and the guy who asks starts getting uncomfortably warm.

That's how the glasses disguise works too. Everyone who works at the Daily Planet live every day in constant mortal fear of accidentally stating the obvious.

Wasn't that an SNL skit?

With the Rock. They weren't afraid of him though they were condescendingly humoring him and he was too oblivious to notice.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: HalloweenJack on November 22, 2017, 06:26:13 PM
He just shows up for work and acts like nothing. If anyone asks questions, he just lowers his glasses a bit, his eyes start glowing, and the guy who asks starts getting uncomfortably warm.

That's how the glasses disguise works too. Everyone who works at the Daily Planet live every day in constant mortal fear of accidentally stating the obvious.

Wasn't that an SNL skit?

With the Rock. They weren't afraid of him though they were condescendingly humoring him and he was too oblivious to notice.

"Ohhhh I have a feeling the prince will be JUST fine."
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: superlurker on November 22, 2017, 09:11:55 PM
He just shows up for work and acts like nothing. If anyone asks questions, he just lowers his glasses a bit, his eyes start glowing, and the guy who asks starts getting uncomfortably warm.

That's how the glasses disguise works too. Everyone who works at the Daily Planet live every day in constant mortal fear of accidentally stating the obvious.

Wasn't that an SNL skit?

With the Rock. They weren't afraid of him though they were condescendingly humoring him and he was too oblivious to notice.

Never seen that. I might go track it down.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: -K-M- on November 22, 2017, 09:36:16 PM
Just got back from it and I liked it. Don't understand the hate. Crazy how many scenes they removed from the one trailer though

But the CGI seemed very wonky in a lot of scenes. Ran out of money due to reshoots?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 23, 2017, 12:36:53 AM
I'm a little mystified by the doomsayers here. If JL makes 96 million - it still has the rest of the wrold's very good box office and several weeks with no competitons. Theaters need to put something in there and if nothing is out, JL will be there. I'm still convinced Thanksgiving will be better anyhow - not sensational mind you, but not bad

I'm making comparison of unicerves that burned through their good will to point out that although DC is underperforming, it's clearly in second place and making money in its genre. It's being threatened, but this film was a pivot and the common theme has been that the universe has bright spots and a lot to get rid of.

A hard reboot would be a mistake. Getting more James Wans to develop individuao franchises and make the right creative choices would be far smarter.

A hard reboot would eat up good will. Even Spiderman homecoming had trouble finding its legs and IMO that should have beena billion dollar movie. It still didn't recapture the Raimi excitement and it hadthe stench of Garfields SpiderMan.

DC has a lot of GREAT stuff to work with and a lot of trash tot ake out (Luthorrr) THis is salvegable
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 23, 2017, 12:38:58 AM
Even Spiderman homecoming had trouble finding its legs and IMO that should have beena billion dollar movie. It still didn't recapture the Raimi excitement and it hadthe stench of Garfields SpiderMan.

Homecoming was the biggest money maker last year among superhero flicks.  It even beat Wonder Woman.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 23, 2017, 01:28:46 AM
Even Spiderman homecoming had trouble finding its legs and IMO that should have beena billion dollar movie. It still didn't recapture the Raimi excitement and it hadthe stench of Garfields SpiderMan.

Homecoming was the biggest money maker last year among superhero flicks.  It even beat Wonder Woman.

Think WW made more money though if we going to start comparing how much money you take from the American box office appose to the international box office like where doing here with JLA.  Wouldnt a 400 million dollar box office in America means they would get a larger cut of that.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 23, 2017, 01:36:34 AM
Even Spiderman homecoming had trouble finding its legs and IMO that should have beena billion dollar movie. It still didn't recapture the Raimi excitement and it hadthe stench of Garfields SpiderMan.

Homecoming was the biggest money maker last year among superhero flicks.  It even beat Wonder Woman.

Think WW made more money though if we going to start comparing how much money you take from the American box office appose to the international box office like where doing here with JLA.  Wouldnt a 400 million dollar box office in America means they would get a larger cut of that.

I'm talking about world wide box office.  The Chinese audience pushed it passed Wonder Woman.

http://www.tvovermind.com/movies/spider-man-homecoming-beats-wonder-woman-become-highest-grossing-movie-summer-2017 (http://www.tvovermind.com/movies/spider-man-homecoming-beats-wonder-woman-become-highest-grossing-movie-summer-2017)
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: MPagar on November 23, 2017, 01:39:30 AM
But the CGI seemed very wonky in a lot of scenes. Ran out of money due to reshoots?

That’s my guess. I’ve also heard from other places that Warner Bros. REALLY wanted the movie out on time, so certain scenes had to be rushed, not to mention the last minute reshoots. The creepy Superman lip Whedon scenes, for example, supposedly had only four or so months until it was to be completed. Then I’d guess other scenes just got more priority time, like the battle ones, which could be why Cyborg looked okay in certain scenes and simply jarring in others(that Superman resurrection scene looked like pre-rendered PS3).
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on November 23, 2017, 01:47:22 AM
I really feel bad for this movie ad I wanted to have it succeed though. However, it looks like due to bad word of mouth, it may not come out as expected vs Marvel Studios:

Comparison:

Avengers

Opening Weekend: $207,438,708

JL:

Opening Weekend:  $93,842,239

-------------------

First 2 days:

Avengers: $18,898,999 + $17,677,190

JL: $7,508,311 + $10,551,093

I'm hoping they can recover from this but as of last reading, WB is preparing to lose around $200M from this movie if fate keeps the course and no amount of post marketing can save it since they already spent loads on it. People will get fired left and right if this happens.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 23, 2017, 07:43:01 AM
Is that Suicide Squad thing serious? It doesn't seem like Suicide Squad would cost much more than Deadpool.

Suicide Squad had a ensemble cast of pretty well established actors - Will Smith's star power has diminished but he still took home about $20 million for his upcoming Netflix film. Its also got a lot more CGI heavy set pieces. Even stuff like the soundtrack for the film was expensive in terms of using well-known songs and i think this quote from the people putting together the SS soundtrack is pretty important in illustrating how the budget can blow up when its not a priority:

Quote
Nor was it cheap. Clearing the rights to a beloved hit song for a film is a pricey proposition, easily running into the six figures. Hilfer and Kent decline to say how big a budget they had. But, with an overall net production budget for the film of about $175 million, they clearly had ample resources.

“You know, it’s a big-budget movie,” Hilfer said. “We were just told to hit it creatively.”

SS also had a lot of reshoots and WB were essentially cutting two different versions of the film as they were trying to decide what to do with it.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/suicide-squads-secret-drama-rushed-916693

Deadpool OTOH had huge budgetary pressure -  it was a movie that was never supposed to be made in the first place and it had to come in at a certain budget because the studio simply wasnt going to give them any more room on that front:

Quote
Fox, understandably fearing failure, continually slashed the budget, and refused to pay for screenwriters Rhett Reese and Paul Wernick to be on-set during the production, at which point Reynolds stepped in - “We were on set every day. Interestingly, Ryan wanted us there. We were on the project for six years. It was really a core creative team of us, Ryan, and the director Tim Miller. Fox, interestingly, wouldn’t pay for us to be on set. Ryan Reynolds paid out of his own money, out of his own pocket.”
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 23, 2017, 05:40:40 PM
The new Pixar movie has knocked JL out of the top spot at the BO - wasnt really sure if that will hold but its predicted to take the Number 1 spot this weekend also:

http://deadline.com/2017/11/coco-justice-league-wonder-thanksgiving-box-office-1202213755/
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 23, 2017, 07:41:26 PM
The new Pixar movie has knocked JL out of the top spot at the BO - wasnt really sure if that will hold but its predicted to take the Number 1 spot this weekend also:

http://deadline.com/2017/11/coco-justice-league-wonder-thanksgiving-box-office-1202213755/

Still 63 million not to bad right now
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bran Mak Morn on November 24, 2017, 06:49:20 AM
Juz saw it last night & I'm still a bit lost for words...I honestly don't know whether I liked the film or not?

The pacing was weird. Weird in the sense of overdone with re-shoots, re-takes, plots being changed at the last minute & THEN we edit the bitch.

So many scenes that felt cut short mid conversation...it literally felt like the max amount of time each character could interact with each other was 3 minutes, any longer & it would be edited.
Basically like a ploy so not one character would outshine the other.

Hell even Rachel & Diane looked liked they wanted no part of this movie...their scenes were just awkward to watch.

Affleck felt like he phoned his role/s in. Just felt like he never got over the negative feedback from BvS.

The island scenes with the Amazons were probably the bit I enjoyed the most...a nod to 300.
But it was a cringe worthy scene to see all the women standing in a CIRCLE with their bows drawn, pointing at a target in the MIDDLE of them...what the hell?
Y'know best to group to one side unless you wanna hit your fellow warrior that's standing behind the tiny box you're aiming at.

And jesus..the coffin reveal.
I seriously laughed out loud in the cinema thinking why is Clark clutching a photo of Kevin Costner?!!??
It took a couple of seconds before I remembered Costner's role.

From the dark broodiness of BvS, this film certainly went down a notch to make it family friendly & popcorn.
Making Supes nicer just means the violence will be played down too.
It was entertaining to see Cavill play a friendlier version but it also felt too much & too late.

Bats, "there's definitely bleeding" brought a chuckle. So did Flash saving one family & then seeing Supes fly off with an entire building.

Overall I'll hold off my judgement until I see on blu-ray what particular scenes are missing.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Dlbiininja on November 24, 2017, 09:30:52 PM
The new Pixar movie has knocked JL out of the top spot at the BO - wasnt really sure if that will hold but its predicted to take the Number 1 spot this weekend also:

http://deadline.com/2017/11/coco-justice-league-wonder-thanksgiving-box-office-1202213755/

I've heard some good reviews for Coco. 
I went to go see JLA yesterday.  Not one fucking person in the theater until me and my girlfriend walked into the theater for that time.  We could have played musical chairs throughout the entire movie and not had an issue. 

I thought it was already gut.  But, I see what everybody he's talking about.  That scene with Batman,"Yea something's definitely bleeding!" On the obviously fake grass,  I knew kinda liked Steppenwolf.  But, was he played by the guy who played Zod?  And Steppenwolf seemed kind of Ivan oozish in some scenes.  Some of the jokes seemed forced like they shouldn't have been there.  Especially, for Batman!  Yea, he's tall!  Seems they're trying to work the Marvel comedic formula, for characters who shouldn't banter, and I didn't like how they Had Barry.  I'm like hold on dude should already be relatively established as a forensic scientist, and around supes, batman, and possibly Arthur's age.  He shouldn't look like he just had his first shave.  I'd be fine if they'd used Wally for that since he'd be around cyborg's age at that time though.  It was cool seeing Cyborg on the screen.  But, he also should have had more time and experience under his belt. 
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: -K-M- on November 24, 2017, 10:26:17 PM
steppenwolf was played by Ciarán Hinds. Wasn’t the actor that played zod
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bran Mak Morn on November 26, 2017, 02:12:07 AM
Apparently an hour's worth of footage was edited out, including Aquaman's backstory.

There's 2 online petitions.

One to restore all the footage for DVD release.

The other is a plea to see the film 6 more times...some guy calculated that that's how much more revenue is needed to keep the DC franchise franchise from collapsing.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 26, 2017, 02:17:48 AM
https://superherotalksite.wordpress.com/2017/11/19/read-zack-snyders-version-and-all-deleted-scenes-of-justice-league/ (https://superherotalksite.wordpress.com/2017/11/19/read-zack-snyders-version-and-all-deleted-scenes-of-justice-league/)

Some of it should have been left in.  Especially the parts where they actually give Steppenwolf an actual purpose.

And apparently they shot scenes with multiple actors including David Thewlis as Ares and they cut them from the final film.  That is a HUGE waste of money.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: MPagar on November 26, 2017, 03:22:43 AM
I think Thewlis might have just been a voiceover. They had Ares pop up and even have pictures of his actor in costume. Still, even a bit of extra scenes to add to the flashback would’ve been fun.

I wish more of Steppenwolf was kept in. Kept hearing there was a bit about him being tired of being Darkseid’s general, and little tidbits like that could have added more to him.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: altoon on November 26, 2017, 10:08:09 AM
Anything explaining his motivation and backstory definitely should have been left in.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on November 26, 2017, 10:17:04 AM
Tomar and Wog too
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 26, 2017, 11:33:52 AM
first jazz and now this

a brotha made of metal cant catch a break
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 26, 2017, 05:29:01 PM
https://superherotalksite.wordpress.com/2017/11/19/read-zack-snyders-version-and-all-deleted-scenes-of-justice-league/ (https://superherotalksite.wordpress.com/2017/11/19/read-zack-snyders-version-and-all-deleted-scenes-of-justice-league/)

Some of it should have been left in.  Especially the parts where they actually give Steppenwolf an actual purpose.

And apparently they shot scenes with multiple actors including David Thewlis as Ares and they cut them from the final film.  That is a HUGE waste of money.

Ha ha- i love that Snyder's version had Gordon flipping off some deadbeat junkie - "Get better at life". Probably also tossed the guy a copy of "Atlas Shrugged" and challenged him to a push-up competition in the Ultimate Edition.

...wow theres some horrific shit in here
- Superman randomly trying to incinerate humans with heat vision because he is confused
- More random people seeing Superman hanging out at Clark Kent's farm
- another meeting with Costner's ghost - is this a monthly thing?
- Bruce's dialogue: "He’s killed people and nothing, not even his hate for Superman can justify killing like that”. WTF? Are these people completely ethically retarded? "I've killed a lot of people and i've gotta say - the fact that I also hate Superman just doesn't make it right...."

"These scenes were done before the re shoots and were only shown to WB Executives aka idiots who don’t appreciate art"

fuuuuck.....
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 27, 2017, 12:14:00 AM
arrghhhh

This w supposed to bookend the Snyder trilogy. Snyder essentially spent the last 4 years recreating a dystopian alt-verse that's somewhere between a music video and Injustice. Given how much the film had to overcome, it turned out ok

Major lesson - the film is bordering 500 million after two weeks with two weeks to go to Star Wars and a low drop - close to 55%? Overall, it may come close to 750-800$

Clearly, DC will have its work cut out to get fans lost at SS back, but so far DC has done Much better at stand alone films in terms of critics, while team films have been schlocky but successful (until arguably now).

Man of Steel was divisie - it is a Zach Snyder atrocity, but there were clearly brilliant moments in it and Snyder managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory as always. Still, it certainly had brilliant moments (first flight, fight with Faora) to balance out the somberness

Wonder Woman was brilliant the whle way through

When DC gets to flesh out its characters it does well - the next on deck is James Wan's Aquaman - if Jason mamoa stays disciplined, it has a lot of potential as does the franchise in general

Most distracting thing about the fracnhise now is Battfleck - I can't not see Affleck and his personal problems when hes in the role
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 27, 2017, 01:16:36 AM
Affleck is treating his Batman role much how I imagine Alec Guinness thought of his role as Obi Wan.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on November 27, 2017, 02:18:18 AM
Affleck is treating his Batman role much how I imagine Alec Guinness thought of his role as Obi Wan.

Except Guinness had enough talent that justified being snooty.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bran Mak Morn on November 27, 2017, 04:32:59 AM
Affleck just acted too relaxed in the costume. There was no longer a definitive distinction between Bruce & Batman.

Hell he seemed overwhelmed & lost for words whenever he shared the screen with the rest of the JL.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Strange on November 27, 2017, 10:50:56 AM
Safado is trying so hard to spin this into some sort of positive light. Makes me feel a bit bad for the guy.

The movie entertained me. I hoped for better action scenes doh. The movie itself was pretty legit terrible. The acting in parts was bad. Like, real bad I would put this in the Transformers and F&F area. Terrible movies but entertaining.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on November 27, 2017, 10:38:43 PM
This crap of a movie is in BIIIIG trouble. It was supposed to hit the 500M marker during the 2nd weekend to rake in the thanksgiving crowd. It managed to get only at $483M.

However, with Coco getting FRESH REVIEWS at 96% on RT and 80% on Meta... moviegoers will likely go for a movie that will entertain them and not get them to complain after watching it.

Again, WB board should fire all those who agreed to this movie disaster. Rebooting the rest of the franchise that isn't named Wonder Woman is the only option. Unfortunately, they need to get a brilliant writer and screenwriter who can merge the upcoming Aquaman and Flash movies into their to-be rebooted universe.

Snyder created this disjointed mess from miscasting to storyboarding. He and M Night Shyamalan should direct a skit in SNL. Then again, those will likely bomb too.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 27, 2017, 11:22:04 PM
$650 million WW is probably the most it will end up with.  Kevin Tsujihara could lose his job over this.

WB micromanaging the shit out of the DCEU and the incompetence of Snyder has led to this.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Master on November 28, 2017, 07:38:03 AM
$650 million WW is probably the most it will end up with.  Kevin Tsujihara could lose his job over this.

WB micromanaging the shit out of the DCEU and the incompetence of Snyder has led to this.

Yes and yes. How you make a mediocre JUSTICE LEAGUE movie is beyond me. Snyder is a hack who has been ruining the DCCU.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 28, 2017, 08:08:57 PM
would blame the wb more if this doesnt make money

making two different movies is the reason lot of these things need to make 700 million just to break even. Thats a HORRIBLE buisness model

People can blame Synder. But it not like they didnt see the dallies...you dont wait till the movie basicly shot to change course that drasticly
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Rynox on November 28, 2017, 09:29:43 PM
Rock is... right.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: -K-M- on November 28, 2017, 09:38:10 PM
Yeah these reshoots pushed it over. Some of th stuff I read that was cut really should have stayed in

Shame it isn’t making huge amount of money to what he should. Movie was actually enjoyable
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: MPagar on November 28, 2017, 10:08:58 PM
It’s more fun than MoS and BvS for me by a long shot. Amusingly enough, part of the reason I was hesitant to watch it was because of the bad taste those two films left in my mouth, and right now I’m wondering how many others have avoided it for that same reason.

What’s crazy is how many people are putting the blame on Whedon for the film’s failure. It’s even gone as far as seeing people blaming him for the lacking CGI. Half the annoyingly present quirky dialogue might have been him, but most of the character interaction was his doing too.

I think the forty or so minutes of cut content, rushed reshoots and even less post production time all helped cut down this film’s final result.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on November 28, 2017, 10:23:43 PM
People blaming Whedon are a vocal minority. They're the uber-nerds, who think Snyder is a god and MoS/BvS are too "adult" for others to understand. They don't matter.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: MPagar on November 28, 2017, 10:29:28 PM
“The general masses wouldn’t get Snyder’s artistic integrity”.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 28, 2017, 11:13:00 PM
think all the leaks didnt help when it came to the PR. 

and some bad press. Like did all the execs really say it was unwatchable or is that just rumor.

Dont think the critics are just bashing it just to bash it. But think there is a certain amount of click bait. Like the whole idea batman will be its own universe which wasnt true.  And think sometime they overly harsh. JLA had it issues...but it wasn't the horror show critics saying they are. Like it not  as good as Avenger but put it on age of ultron level.

Think WW was help because it was better edited...the director said it no director cut because everything she film pretty much in it. So she didnt get mess with to much

Like even though I like suicide squad. Wouldnt mind Joker going after the squad a little bit more. Which what seem to happen in the orginal cut. Also they really soften the harely relatinship up...where he reduce to just harely boyfriend
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Accel on November 29, 2017, 12:38:43 AM
WB deserves FAR more flack than Snyder for their handling of their cinematic universe.  Man  Steel was fine for what it was, but I clearly wasn't originally meant to be a jumping-on point for an extended universe until Avengers made a boat-load of money, so WB used it as an awkward starting point for the DCEU.

Then there's how they tried so hard to set up their universe in BvS that they forgot to make a good movie, the executive meddling of Suicide Squad, and overall just not having a plan.
They're not Sony-level bad, but they've proven
to be pretty incompetent at this.


At least we got a fun Wonder Woman movie out of it.  I was hoping to see what the solo Batfleck film was going to be like, but now that doesn't look like it's going to happen either. 
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on November 29, 2017, 01:39:52 AM
The bad thing  is the other franchises WB has are running well except for the DCEU.

They rushed ahead without a solid plan in place in a desperate attempt to catch Marvel, becoming extremely reactionary and throwing shit at the wall hoping it sticks.

It's a damn miracle WW turned at the way it did when factoring in WBs micromanaging and panicking.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bandido on November 29, 2017, 01:56:35 AM
Think they'll do a hard reboot across the board?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: MPagar on November 29, 2017, 02:14:20 AM
Hope not. They just got the group together. It’s a shame they have so much baggage from Justice League, BvS and MoS. Regaining momentum is gonna be tough, and I don’t think another WW-level success beforehand would help since it didn’t do so this time.

With Wondy having a degree of success, I think they’re gonna hold back a reboot until they can get a bit more out of that. Any reboot would need to wait to distance itself from the current films.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 29, 2017, 02:37:59 AM
naaa the reboot idea is dumb

I mean all their movies have made money. this one might not if the rumors are True. But that because they have to make a profit of two movies combine. Even then bet it make it a profit, just not a huge one

I just need to stop making it so they need to make 800 millions bucks to make a profit,  A lot of people seem to like the character in this.  It is a fun movie

People seem to like Harley, batman
WW, Aquabro.  They seem to like the direction superman headed. To scrap that would be a bad idea

Just need to clam down. Suicide Squad 2 shouldnt have a bigger budget then Avengers...that just dumb
Neither should Gotham Sirens

both those movies should be a success.

Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on November 29, 2017, 05:09:17 AM
When a TV show has more excitement than a movie.  ;D ;D ;D

http://theweek.com/articles/729712/real-justice-league-cw
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 29, 2017, 11:36:00 PM
I'm not spinning this - I thought the film would land at around 800 Million and now it looks like it will end up at 650 million which is just embarassing

I just saw it a second time and it hurt me, the audience was laughing, hooting an having a great time on a wednesday night. Superman was the best Superman since Reeve and I loved everyone but....Batman

From a business point of view - many of the characters are fixed or introduced. WW is sensational. Cyborg was surprisingly good, though he won't be able to carry his own flick. I'm downright psyched about Superman. Flash and Aquaman need serious adjustments but they have a lot to work with. I loved how they portrayed the Green Lantern in the flashback, he wasn't wonky and if he's portrayed as having some definitions to his powerset I could be onboard.

Any of these charactersin a solo film can kick all sorts of ass.

On the other hand some casting decisions have to seriosuly be remade

Joe Manginello s Deathstroke looked like a bad actor doing cosplay

Luthor is ruining one of comics best villains - This should be DC's Loki (Eisneberg)

and so on

If great casting is married to great directors and writers (Gadot/Jenkins forget the script writer) a new JL will be a natural fit

Right now this feels like the Marvel universe pre-2008. Some flicks hit big but its clear that they're working some things out.

I fully expect Infinity War to total 3 billion or more between 2 films and Phase 4 to be a little easier for other companies to build their universes in.

If DC keeps with ghe good characterizations, recasts batman and Deathstroke and finds Feige or Kennedy, great things can happen. If not, then it will continue to e hit or missi

This film should be Warners wake up call - not hitting 700 million is embarassing considering that the film was ok - although it had serious flaes

From an artistic POV, the poor structure made some characters look bad. Batman looks out-of-place because he's written as comic relief for one thing and his physicality is written up as opposed to his brilliance. In a JL movie, Batman isn't going to spin kick people, he needs a plot good enough to allow him to be the stoic, chess master who outplans the enemy while Superman and WW do the heavy lifting

JL had such a one-dimensional, awful villain it made the hero's look underwhelming when just having a human play the part might have made the fight scnes look more dramatic

The worst part is that all the actors meshed well, did great jobs at characterization, and had little to work with

Hope Warner learns
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Rynox on November 30, 2017, 12:39:26 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/u7SzQSU.gif)

Too soon?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: INDRA THUNDERER on November 30, 2017, 01:56:40 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/u7SzQSU.gif)

Too soon?
lol
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on November 30, 2017, 02:13:28 AM
why does thanos have a nutsack chin
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Prime on November 30, 2017, 02:18:51 AM
Think they'll do a hard reboot across the board?

They can do a soft reboot via Flashpoint. Use that movie to explain away Batffleck leaving and replace him with a younger Batman maybe. Do that and leave everything else the same.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: INDRA THUNDERER on November 30, 2017, 08:41:03 AM
Think they'll do a hard reboot across the board?

They can do a soft reboot via Flashpoint. Use that movie to explain away Batffleck leaving and replace him with a younger Batman maybe. Do that and leave everything else the same.
Or do a Flashpoint reboot,& connect the TV shows with the movies via Crisis
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Ditto on November 30, 2017, 08:54:08 AM
WW is sensational? She didn’t do a god damned thing in this movie except look useless compared to Superman. I wish I could see these movies through the eyes of DC tryhards.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: -K-M- on November 30, 2017, 09:16:24 AM
You guys were right WB was mostly to blame. Apparently didn’t want to delay release as could have impacted corporate members bonuses

https://batman-news.com/2017/11/29/justice-league-drama-zack-snyder-warner-bros/ (https://batman-news.com/2017/11/29/justice-league-drama-zack-snyder-warner-bros/)

“And then there were the reshoots, which included many new scenes of Henry Cavill’s Superman. But there was one problem. Cavill had a mustache for Mission Impossible 6, which he was shooting at the same time, and contractually couldn’t shave it. Warner Bros. would have to digitally remove it, and the November 17th release date was just a few months away. Delaying the movie was probably the best decision, but here’s where it gets ugly…

AT&T and Time Warner are currently in the middle of a $85 billion dollar deal that they were hoping would close by the end of the year. One source told The Wrap that WB CEO Kevin Tsujihara and President Toby Emmerich “wanted to preserve their bonuses they would be paid before the merger,” and were worried that “if they pushed the movie, then their bonuses would have been pushed to the following year and they might not still be at the studio.”
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on November 30, 2017, 11:59:16 AM
You guys were right WB was mostly to blame. Apparently didn’t want to delay release as could have impacted corporate members bonuses

Eh its not that simple IMO. Moving a film date close to release is not a trivial thing. Besides - they had enough problems already with the reshoots they did that half the cast was off doing other films/promotional work and growing facial hair etc. Delaying the film would mean more money on reshoots and/or CGI, more money changing promotional material and a lot more publicity regarding the idea that its a film thats not working out as planned.

WB really fucked up when they let Snyder talk them into the idea that the best way to bounce back from the disappointing BO of MOS was to let him make BvS instead of a straight MOS sequel. And then to go straight from the release of that into the production of JL which meant that they couldnt remove Snyder without acknowledging that people hated BvS. You have to admire the guys self-promotional ability that he was able to parlay relative failure into his being handed creative control of pretty much everything I guess.

You could almost blame Nolan - the success of his Batman films convinced a ton of WB people that the key to making good comic book films was to make them as dark as the material would allow and he picked Snyder to do Superman after WB begged him to do it himself. Funnily enough Matt Reeves - who is now doing the Batman films that may/may not happen (and directed 2 of the fucking awesome Apes trilogy) was passed over for Snyder.

Basically once Snyder had made 75% of a film that followed directly along a direction/storyline that audiences hated WB were fucked.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Master on November 30, 2017, 07:33:01 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/u7SzQSU.gif)

This is my face whenever I try deciphering a long Rock post.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on November 30, 2017, 08:21:37 PM
Soft reboot is the answer

DC is hard without the Trinity as a foundation and Batman Battfelck is not pulling his weight. Aside from the script problems which make batman oo bad Affleck is phoning it in

Say what you will about Batman vs Superman but Afleck had two amazing scenes tht brought real intensity  to make up for the script and inconsistencies

THe opening scene of BVS with Affleck running into the disaster zone while everyone is running away shows just how fierce and fearless Bruce Wyane is - and borderline psychotic

The warehouse scene is easily the best Batman fighht scene put to film to date

Battfelck has clearly lost the intensity he brought to that role. As much as the script didn't let him show much intensity he didn't really bring much to the film - he underperformed compared to his talent and that's unfortunate. I wouldn't mind Battfelck having the role as long as he wants so long as he brings it

A soft reboot works best - keeps all the best things about the DCEU and doesn't alienate the fans the same way a hard reboot like Spiderman and Garfield did to that franchise. As well as Homecoming did, it took a while to generate enthusiasm and this is SPider Man were talking about

Flashpoint can reboot it in a way that recasts Batman, Luthor, Lois Lane, and a few other characters who are dragging everyone else down and replace them with actors ready to bring the intensity needed. I'd get rid of Jared leto but apparently some people like him
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: scourge on November 30, 2017, 11:59:03 PM
Just saw it.

Thoughts:

- They didn't really care about this. Clearly just pushed off the assembly line to beat Avengers to the 'alien from space after items of power goes against a bunch of heroes' storyline. Felt like a mid to decent level JLU episode, which is passing for a movie, but kind of underwhelming.
- All and all, still better than I expected.
- All and all, I'd give it a C.
- Not incredibly worth seeing, but also how could I not see it?
- Gal Gadot was again the best thing on the screen, but everyone else was still ok.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Strawman Abridged on December 01, 2017, 12:49:13 AM
Shoulda gone with Starro as the villain, man. Shoulda gone wit Starro.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on December 01, 2017, 03:24:52 AM
Even if you have Thanos cross-over to DC but the graphic engine they will be using is for a N64 hardware...  ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: scourge on December 01, 2017, 09:33:36 AM
WW is sensational? She didn’t do a god damned thing in this movie except look useless compared to Superman. I wish I could see these movies through the eyes of DC tryhards.

While I also think safado’s post that you’re pulling this from is way too kind to what they put out, he is right in that Wonder Woman was great.

How about just see the movie through the eyes of someone who’s more interested in other aspects of character portrayal beyond how much pew-peeing they do.

Gal Gadot brought the character to life in a compelling way. She was charming and believable in the role, every scene she was in was very watchable which to me counts for much more than how hard she punched or fast she moved. Amy Adams was also really good. Excellent lead ladies casting at the very least. Oh and the location scout for the Aquaman village also deserves some love. I could have watched a lot more of that setting.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on December 01, 2017, 09:43:29 AM
Just saw it.

Thoughts:

- They didn't really care about this. Clearly just pushed off the assembly line to beat Avengers to the 'alien from space after items of power goes against a bunch of heroes' storyline.

Yeah, and they did it by negative-five-years.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: The Captain on December 01, 2017, 01:32:56 PM
Soft reboot is the answer

DC is hard without the Trinity as a foundation and Batman Battfelck is not pulling his weight. Aside from the script problems which make batman oo bad Affleck is phoning it in

Say what you will about Batman vs Superman but Afleck had two amazing scenes tht brought real intensity  to make up for the script and inconsistencies

THe opening scene of BVS with Affleck running into the disaster zone while everyone is running away shows just how fierce and fearless Bruce Wyane is - and borderline psychotic

The warehouse scene is easily the best Batman fighht scene put to film to date

Battfelck has clearly lost the intensity he brought to that role. As much as the script didn't let him show much intensity he didn't really bring much to the film - he underperformed compared to his talent and that's unfortunate. I wouldn't mind Battfelck having the role as long as he wants so long as he brings it

A soft reboot works best - keeps all the best things about the DCEU and doesn't alienate the fans the same way a hard reboot like Spiderman and Garfield did to that franchise. As well as Homecoming did, it took a while to generate enthusiasm and this is SPider Man were talking about

Flashpoint can reboot it in a way that recasts Batman, Luthor, Lois Lane, and a few other characters who are dragging everyone else down and replace them with actors ready to bring the intensity needed. I'd get rid of Jared leto but apparently some people like him

Not to derail the thread but I would like to put forward the notion that we call this version of Batman 'Battfelck' from now on :D
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Ditto on December 01, 2017, 02:05:16 PM
WW is sensational? She didn’t do a god damned thing in this movie except look useless compared to Superman. I wish I could see these movies through the eyes of DC tryhards.

While I also think safado’s post that you’re pulling this from is way too kind to what they put out, he is right in that Wonder Woman was great.

How about just see the movie through the eyes of someone who’s more interested in other aspects of character portrayal beyond how much pew-peeing they do.

Gal Gadot brought the character to life in a compelling way. She was charming and believable in the role, every scene she was in was very watchable which to me counts for much more than how hard she punched or fast she moved. Amy Adams was also really good. Excellent lead ladies casting at the very least. Oh and the location scout for the Aquaman village also deserves some love. I could have watched a lot more of that setting.

What lasting impression did she leave on you? She had no stand out scenes. I loved Wonder Woman and she felt wasted in JL, though not nearly as wasted at Batman. It has nothing to do with “pew pew.” Her being watchable doesn’t mean anything compared to doing something or being memorable. I couldn’t care less about feats outside of correcting fangirl or the very rare battle board debate I get involved in.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on December 01, 2017, 02:14:29 PM
WW is sensational? She didn’t do a god damned thing in this movie except look useless compared to Superman. I wish I could see these movies through the eyes of DC tryhards.

While I also think safado’s post that you’re pulling this from is way too kind to what they put out, he is right in that Wonder Woman was great.

How about just see the movie through the eyes of someone who’s more interested in other aspects of character portrayal beyond how much pew-peeing they do.

Gal Gadot brought the character to life in a compelling way. She was charming and believable in the role, every scene she was in was very watchable which to me counts for much more than how hard she punched or fast she moved. Amy Adams was also really good. Excellent lead ladies casting at the very least. Oh and the location scout for the Aquaman village also deserves some love. I could have watched a lot more of that setting.

What lasting impression did she leave on you? She had no stand out scenes. I loved Wonder Woman and she felt wasted in JL, though not nearly as wasted at Batman. It has nothing to do with “pew pew.” Her being watchable doesn’t mean anything compared to doing something or being memorable. I couldn’t care less about feats outside of correcting fangirl or the very rare battle board debate I get involved in.

Her opening scene was one of the best in the film and left an impression. Also, Gal was very charismatic and I enjoyed every time she was on screen. I liked her chemistry with Affleck and their interactions. Her fight with Steppenwolf was well choreographed and showed off her skills very well.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: scourge on December 01, 2017, 02:23:08 PM
Lasting impression, I think I spoke to that: she was charming, charismatic (stealing that word, 80's) and believable. Didn't try to hard, didn't need to put up a front, yet her confidence still shown through. Not cocky at all, but self assured. Self aware. Able to accept criticism and not push against it instinctively. All of that played as it should have been played. Which is to say subtlety, but in a way that was very easy to pick up. Small choices etc. She didn't feel like a 2-Dimensional cartoon character. She's probably the finest rep of what a hero should be in any of this--not to be confused with trying to be what a hero should be like say Superman--but actually being that and embodying it.

So yeah, she didn't make any great speeches (though the "I'm a believer" line from the opening was pretty nice), didn't deliver any knock-em-out-of-the-park one liners (the line about her weekend not being exciting was ok but throwing every funny line into a trailer is a bad move so saw it coming), but she was consistent and great in that consistency and it was boiled down nicely in that opening, her feel there carried through.

----End Wonder Woman specific discussion, start of overall take discussion---

Now I agree the movie didn't have anything that great, there were no really memorable parts that were memorable for their wonderful execution, and as a whole it just felt very phoned in in a lot of ways. I guess this was an ikea desk of a movie on the whole. They had most of the parts they needed, they managed to fit them together, they had other parts they probably needed to put in but the desk was reasonably standing without them so they threw those away, and they said "look, we got this desk, it's not great, but it serves as a desk"

Meanwhile Marvel is giving us Raymore and Flanigan level desks... though I'm still waiting for someone to give us a handcrafted artisanal desk that makes Marvel's Raymore and Flannigan look like DC's IKEA.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on December 01, 2017, 09:38:31 PM
Battfelck hehehehe

Everything said about WW and added to that the fact that despite her immense power, she embodies heart and love more than any other hero on the team. If batman is meant to be the epitome of what a man can be, Superman is everything man can aspire to be, WW is clearly what woman can be. She is at the same time fearsome, powerful, skilled, ferocious, unstoppable, tenacious . charismatic and beautiful. She's also loving, nurturing, caring and somewhat maternal and plays the mother hen of the group even while she is clearly the second most powerful person there.

I was a little impressed in characterization in how they really managed to make Wonder Woman the embodiment of everything a woman could be and Superman could be the inspiration , hope and power while they don't just seem like male and female counterparts of each other

they're not the captain of the football team and the chearleading squad; they are both very different but ultimately the best representations of their archetypes possible

Batman fails horribly at his archetype. Affleck doesn't bring the same intensity to the role as he did in BvS and the role was not written well for him. So 2 out of 3 in the Trinity.

Rewatching it I was surprised at how endearing I found Ezra Miller Flash to be. I love the CW Flash to death, but Miller Flash felt like JLU Flash which was fun.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on December 03, 2017, 09:21:34 AM
I'm with Ditto on this. Again I havent seen WW yet - but nowhere in BvS or JL did I think anything close to "Wow, Gal Gadot is one charismatic/talented actress who really brings this character to life". In BvS she was downright pretty bad in scenes that involved stuff like walking and talking and acting. She basically comes across as a very Snyder-esque choice for the role - somebody who looks right for the part.

Now maybe I will enjoy WW as much as most people seemed to when i get round to watching it - maybe she will even give a really great performance in that movie. But that doesnt change her performance here and i do find it a little odd how public consensus went from "She was pretty fucking terrible" in BvS to "OMG she is amaaaaaaazing in every scene". I did find it faintly ridiculous how they seemed to shoehorn random extra shots of her smiling into the end battle scenes of JL (something that was mentioned as being part of the Whedon reshoots) apparently just because thats something that critics really liked about her in the fight with Doomsday.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on December 03, 2017, 10:16:44 AM
The general consensus was that Wonder Woman was one of the few good things in BvS, actually. That goodwill carried over to her solo film, which increased it and now this one. The love for Gal has actually been pretty consistent.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on December 03, 2017, 06:24:30 PM
Gal Gadot's intensity and charisma comes across even despite Snyder's borderline misogynistic directing.

It's also hard to appreciate just how good she is in the role without watching Wonder Woman. That film was directed by a woman, pays attention to details that only a woman would appreciate and make relatable to a female audience and still loses nothing of the characters charm for men watching

A few examples

In BvS her entrance and theme song is the best scene in the movie along with the battle preceding and following it. her entrance was a complete surprise and the movie was good enough to give me a chill. Even still during the fight Snyder has her take a shot from Doomsday, roll over in a pose that I have paused the image and beat meat to, and look "horny?" in said magnificent pose. It was so overtly sexual that it nearly took away from character and was clearly Snyder trying to make her female Superman. Female but ultimately limitless powerful and indifferent to the humanity she was allegedly trying to protect; though in Supermans case he's clearly protecting humanity because of Lois and very little else

In Justice League she is a feirce warrior but she's also very warm, caring, motherly, and represents the best of women while losing nothing as a warrior. She's the first to charge into battle at all times and despite the lack of narrative development we see her develop within the film.

She confesses to Bruce that she is dfearless in a fight but that she is afraid to lead; after all, she can take the bruises herself but she can't bear the thought of leading people into battle and risk their deaths being on her head. A few scenes later she's leading the forming JL into battle and she's the one who reassures Cyborg that they won't let him be subsumed by his machinery; she's the one encouraging Flash and telling Aquaman what to do

She is essentially the perfect combination of power, ferocity and heart in a way that is distinctively more feminine than Superman; who finally assumes the role we've wanted him to play all along

As for the WW movie - Patty Jenkins recreated all of the Superman 1 scenes in a WW1 setting and handled things like her power, sexuality, and fericyty in a way that was very feminine but not cliched. It was truly good

The scene where she walsk into battle for the first time in the trench warfare scene was a WW version of the falling helicopter scene and she is always charging headlong in direction of her beliefs. It's endearing and distinct.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on December 03, 2017, 08:20:54 PM
What would you say are the odds of "Justice League" beating "Wonder Woman" in final money numbers?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: AP on December 03, 2017, 10:08:39 PM
What would you say are the odds of "Justice League" beating "Wonder Woman" in final money numbers?

I'm wondering if it can even make MoS numbers.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bran Mak Morn on December 03, 2017, 10:57:08 PM
Or will people be more interested in buying the blu-ray IF the extra hour of edited/deleted footage is reinstated?
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on December 03, 2017, 11:39:08 PM
JL won't be able to beat Wonder Woman based on the trend. Unless they keep the running for this movie for another 2 weeks. However, there is already a drop of more than 200 theaters pulling out JL from their lineup.

However the 3rd weekend (where JL managed to exclipse the $500 mark), WW is "leagues" above it.

3rd weekend stats :

WW - $41,268,850

JL - $16,580,000

Hopefully, JL still make it past the 650M mark. However, that is not a considered financial success compared to WW and even Marvel's Avengers.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: therock on December 03, 2017, 11:40:58 PM
JL won't be able to beat Wonder Woman based on the trend. Unless they keep the running for this movie for another 2 weeks. However, there is already a drop of more than 200 theaters pulling out JL from their lineup.

However the 3rd weekend (where JL managed to exclipse the $500 mark), WW is "leagues" above it.

3rd weekend stats :

WW - $41,268,850

JL - $16,580,000

Hopefully, JL still make it past the 650M mark. However, that is not a considered financial success compared to WW and even Marvel's Avengers.

Why you say even marvel avenger. didnt avenger make more then WW
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Panthergod on December 03, 2017, 11:50:48 PM
I'm with Ditto on this. Again I havent seen WW yet - but nowhere in BvS or JL did I think anything close to "Wow, Gal Gadot is one charismatic/talented actress who really brings this character to life". In BvS she was downright pretty bad in scenes that involved stuff like walking and talking and acting. She basically comes across as a very Snyder-esque choice for the role - somebody who looks right for the part.

Now maybe I will enjoy WW as much as most people seemed to when i get round to watching it - maybe she will even give a really great performance in that movie. But that doesnt change her performance here and i do find it a little odd how public consensus went from "She was pretty fucking terrible" in BvS to "OMG she is amaaaaaaazing in every scene". I did find it faintly ridiculous how they seemed to shoehorn random extra shots of her smiling into the end battle scenes of JL (something that was mentioned as being part of the Whedon reshoots) apparently just because thats something that critics really liked about her in the fight with Doomsday.

she is the virtual embodiment of the character while on screen. Shame on you for having watched JL without seeing WW first. you cannot fully comprehend her without that. And she was the only flawless performance in JL.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on December 03, 2017, 11:55:24 PM
What do you think of Cavill's new Superman?

Some very good moments IMO

Flash has potential but feels underdeveloped.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Panthergod on December 04, 2017, 12:04:33 AM
What do you think of Cavill's new Superman?

Some very good moments IMO

Flash has potential but feels underdeveloped.

Better, but unearned. this 'we need Superman' desperate nonsense was laughable? we need the delusional nutjob who NEVER admitted to being personally responsible for hundreds of deaths after considering letting people die because they arent worth saving?

This guy does NOT believe' in truth and Justice, no matetr what he says when peole are around. To him, in his trues moments, as we saw,  "Superman was never real'. They're going to address their horrid emo bitch portrayal directly, and fix it they way it should have always been fixed: a public statement to the world openly detailing his mission and purpose(y'know, what Richard Donner figured out in act fucking 2 of Superman the Movie, not after THREE separate clusterfucks), and establishing his Code against killing. You'd think a professional reporter would know a slight bit about public relations.


Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on December 04, 2017, 01:36:40 PM
The general consensus was that Wonder Woman was one of the few good things in BvS, actually. That goodwill carried over to her solo film, which increased it and now this one. The love for Gal has actually been pretty consistent.

The consensus from Batman v Superman was that WWs appearance in the Doomsday fight was the only bright spot in the movie because she smiled and was generally a little less gloomy. Nobody praised Gadot's performance as Diana outside the combat scenes though (at least not in any coherent sense - looking around theres a few reviews that say she "steals every scene shes in"...but then only mention that she smiles and looks like shes having fun fighting Doomsday).

she is the virtual embodiment of the character while on screen. Shame on you for having watched JL without seeing WW first. you cannot fully comprehend her without that. And she was the only flawless performance in JL.

I think we are going to have to agree to disagree that her performance in JL was "flawless".
Sorry I saw JL before WW also.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: 80sBaby on December 04, 2017, 01:43:46 PM
The general consensus was that Wonder Woman was one of the few good things in BvS, actually. That goodwill carried over to her solo film, which increased it and now this one. The love for Gal has actually been pretty consistent.

The consensus from Batman v Superman was that WWs appearance in the Doomsday fight was the only bright spot in the movie because she smiled and was generally a little less gloomy. Nobody praised Gadot's performance as Diana outside the combat scenes though (at least not in any coherent sense - looking around theres a few reviews that say she "steals every scene shes in"...but then only mention that she smiles and looks like shes having fun fighting Doomsday).

Not disagreeing that the fight scene was where she got the most praise. I was just saying that nobody was saying bad things about her in the film's reviews. So her getting praise after her movie and in this one isn't really too shocking or a complete 180.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Fifthchild on December 04, 2017, 01:44:48 PM
What would you say are the odds of "Justice League" beating "Wonder Woman" in final money numbers?

Zero. As mentioned its probably looking at MOS numbers WW atm. Maybe less.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on December 04, 2017, 02:19:02 PM
What do you think of Cavill's new Superman?



He was plainly cast to embody Snyder's cold, alien Superman, and simply can't sell the attempt to retcon him into more of a Christopher Reeve type. He reminds me of Pennywise when it's trying to pretend to be a friendly clown.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: NeoGreenLantern on December 04, 2017, 03:28:08 PM
I don't blame him for that. I think starting him off cold really spoiled Cavill's pretty good portrayal of real Superman. If we got that from the beginning I think people would be on board with him.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: HalloweenJack on December 04, 2017, 05:51:17 PM
What do you think of Cavill's new Superman?



He was plainly cast to embody Snyder's cold, alien Superman, and simply can't sell the attempt to retcon him into more of a Christopher Reeve type. He reminds me of Pennywise when it's trying to pretend to be a friendly clown.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdf2tqSy2zc
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on December 04, 2017, 07:13:52 PM
OK

Fair enough

It was jarring to establish Superman as the symbol of hope when the films before it portrayed Injustice Superman. I thought it was a tough sell for him to come back and suddenly the world, which had been divided against him in the frsit place, was suddenly mourning him, Tht's the problem with a rushed film

Using poetic license I took it as his choice to sacrifice his life was his turning point as a chacter but that was the story I told to sell myself.

It makes sense but DC was painted into a corner and hiring Snyder and lots of wrong talented attached to the wrong scripts is the real culprit.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: MPagar on December 04, 2017, 07:37:58 PM
I thought it was a tough sell for him to come back and suddenly the world, which had been divided against him in the frsit place, was suddenly mourning him, Tht's the problem with a rushed film

You’d need more than a single film to undo that mess. In fact, I think it might have been pretty much impossible by then. The foundation they had set with Man of Steel was so shaky to begin with, but BvS just made it more irredeemable with how they portrayed the characters.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on December 04, 2017, 11:10:56 PM
I don't understand why DC can't get the freakin concept of:

LIGHT and DARKNESS... but the idiots of WB decided to make it DARKNESS and DARKNESS.

Good way to kill a rare team-up that should have netted billions as a franchise per film.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=194&v=a8P8z3k3aCU
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on December 05, 2017, 02:39:27 PM
Thats an amazing mash up. I would have loved to see Justice League Cavill and BvS Superman with an actual good script.

Snyder is so, so very disappointing
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Bran Mak Morn on December 05, 2017, 04:44:12 PM
I thought it was a tough sell for him to come back and suddenly the world, which had been divided against him in the frsit place, was suddenly mourning him,

I wouldn't say mourning him.
He come back to his statue completely demolished & that newspaper article was most likely written by Lois.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Uhtceare on December 05, 2017, 05:27:24 PM
Thats an amazing mash up. I would have loved to see Justice League Cavill and BvS Superman with an actual good script.

Snyder is so, so very disappointing

Cavill sucks.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: -K-M- on December 07, 2017, 07:06:42 PM
[EDIT: POSTED IN WRONG THREAD]
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on December 07, 2017, 11:21:28 PM
Current box office receipt is looming at 573M. Looks like by the 4th weekend the most they can get is 10M (this is a generous estimate)... they won't make it to 600M.

This puts them either in the red or break-even. But the budget of 300M + 100M (mass re-shoots) and not taking print and media ads... and actor receipt %... well sheit... heads will roll  ;D
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: DarthAlani on December 07, 2017, 11:24:12 PM
Heads are already rolling. Big changes coming in January.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on December 08, 2017, 12:29:10 AM
You are right.

https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/12/07/justice-league-failure-dc-shakeup-jon-berg-geoff-johns/

As this film turned into a red-line to break even, heads are now on the chopping board.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on December 09, 2017, 01:11:34 PM
If this inspires them to get a Feige/Kennedy type leader and keep the best things about the DCEU so far, they could have an incredible franchise

Character for character DC has a far deeper and richer mythology that can attract more auteur directors than Marvel can - it just has to develop its dynamic and build on the good its developed

Cavill's best moments in MoS and JL - perfect (MoS was a flawed movie with some epic moments - mix in with Cavil's charimsa and the power dynamic and you have Superman)

WW - perfect

A disciplined Jason Mamoa in Aquaman, Ezra Miller reigning it in and developing Flash, Viola Davis, Will Smith Deadshot, Margot Robbie, A more developed Bruce Wayne along with Batman ala Battfleck, Teen Titans,
a fun Green Lantern, Cyborg

Lot's to work with and plenty to discard

If the stakes weren't so high, this reminds me of Marvel finding its feet with two Hulk films, Blade, and how many other properties before nailing it with Iron Man. Pockets of excellence and promise before unifying into a creative front





Viola Davis

Flash  more disciplined, less goofy
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on December 09, 2017, 11:46:39 PM
A Forbes analyst has predicted that this movie will cost WB $60-70M in the red.

The only way this can be saved is which you mentioned before: merchandising. However, this is based on a long term (years) recuperation which the higher ups are not interested in.

2 high execs rushed the showing expecting the AT & T merger to go through with their bonuses to be cancelled due to the merger. They were hoping the band-aid patched Justice League would convince their board that they deserved the massive bonus in case JL became a hit... it would still be dumb if their board gives them the bonus by year-end... but hey... this is how corporate America works. You get a bonus  regardless of how lousy you did. Meanwhile, the peons who helped slave it out gets nothing because... well, the film failed.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: nu-safado on December 12, 2017, 01:15:34 AM
Yeah, I don't think the film will make 700 mill but the creative reshuffle might end up working out in everyones favor
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: XerxesTWD on December 12, 2017, 04:15:44 PM
You are right.

https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/12/07/justice-league-failure-dc-shakeup-jon-berg-geoff-johns/

As this film turned into a red-line to break even, heads are now on the chopping board.
Geoff Johns has a shitty nickname.
Title: Re: Justice League Spoilers
Post by: Commander on December 12, 2017, 10:49:39 PM
Yup. Looks like Geoff works good on animated and even live tv series but can't do sheit on live film. It's either his inputs on live film are being ignored or he just sits in the corner writing another series to do.

Anyway, latest stat: Worldwide:    $615,472,996   

Still short of the "alleged" break even cost of 650M.